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Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

bbc.co.uk

101–110 of 256 posts

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also an English word that can be used for the same kind of thing without the law being involved at all.

And in situations where the law isn't involved, that's great. Here, though, it is. Talking about damages being paid , as the headline does, is especially indicative of the legal context.

Yeah, context is key here... Damages can also mean physical bodily harm. By GP's reasoning, we could interpret the article as saying someone was medically wounded and claim that to be a correct interpretation because it's one of the many meanings depending on context.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#102
post #37

> The individual admitted running a campaign which "involved the systematic dissemination of false and defamatory allegations" against Mr Nolan. I think that it is good that someone got to own up for the turdslinging they do online, but why are we ok with platforms that aren’t held accountable for the “systematic dissemination of false and defamatory allegations” they enable? What if you don’t have BBC lawyers and re…

He was banned in order for Joe Biden to win. Plain and simple. Same as why Hunter Biden stories were being blocked on Facebook as untrue, even though they were true. It made one candidate look bad. It’s important to remember there is a narrative that stories must fit. The next Republican candidate will be declared mean, dumb, all-phobic to everyone. Everything they say will be “fact checked” and proven false. Doesn’t…

What are you talking about? Biden had already won when Trump was banned.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#103
The title isn't a reasonable one: the very prejudicial descriptor 'troll' is language from lawyers from one side of a legal dispute. The BBC isn't credibly a neutral arbiter, because the litigant is one of their presenters.

This is not taking any position on the underlying dispute (which is apparently about Northern Ireland politics [0]), nor is it a criticism of or specific to the BBC.

[0] This Reddit discussion (probably) isn't about the accusation that allegedly was defamatory (that's not public knowledge AFAIK), but I think illustrates the character of the dispute, between the Twitter user and the BBC presenter:

>"His Nolan guest analysis showed nationalist views are represented 6% of the time while unionist views get 65% of the airtime. That's gone from Twitter. Does anyone have a copy?" ("His" refers to "@PastorJimberoo1, @PastorJimberoo3")

https://old.reddit.com/r/northernireland/comments/nmzp90/wha...

~~~~~

[very late EDIT]: I've found one of the allegedly libelous claims. In the Irish Times, the Twitter user is reported as saying (through an attorney)

>"I also set up a change.org petition against Mr Nolan, which had been based entirely on false and defamatory allegations, with the aim of undermining and damaging his professional reputation."

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/twitter-user-t...

There's clear evidence (from searching social media, from multiple directions: @username + 'petition', or stephan nolan + 'petition', &c.) that the referenced petition is this one, which asks the BBC to cancel Stephen Nolan's program:

https://www.change.org/p/bbc-the-bbc-ni-nolan-show-should-be... (is this link dead for everyone or just me?)

https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Y0T0IQ...

So, one of the claims that's conceded as defamatory is (to my inference, drawn from the above):

>"For example, on 3rd February 2021, the show provided a platform for an unelected representative of illegal proscribed paramilitary organisations to threaten violence relating to the NI Protocol. This is highly irresponsible and risks inflaming tensions which could lead to violence. However this is not a unique example and the show regularly platforms unelected representatives and apologists for paramilitary organisations."

For even further confirmation: here's the BBC singling out this petition as defamatory, back in Feburary:

>"THE BBC has said an online petition campaigning for the cancellation of The Stephen Nolan Show is an attempt to “smear and censor” its journalism."

>"The petition, which passed 10,000 signatures over the weekend, claims the award-winning BBC Radio Ulster programme “seeks to stir sectarian tensions for ratings”."

>"A statement accompanying the online campaign cites an interview broadcast on Radio Ulster on February 3 2021 with “an unelected representative of illegal proscribed paramilitary organisations”, where it claims threats of violence were made."

>"It is understood the comments relate to the interview with the chair of Loyalist Communities Council (LCC), David Campbell on the Northern Ireland Protocol, where he told Mr Nolan: "If it comes to the bit where we have to fight physically to maintain our freedoms within the UK, so be it.""

https://www.irishnews.com/news/northernirelandnews/2021/02/1...

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#104
post #2

I'm a fan of free speech, but defamation is one of the limits I agree with. The UK has a stricter framework than the US, but I think these cases should happen in the US too. It's good to see precedent being established for prosecuting those that abuse social media for evil. I'm interested in who the guilty party is in this case. They can afford a six figure penalty and want to remain anonymous.

Defamation is a great way for those with money to silence dissent and avoid any consequences. Say our product sucks? Defamation. Claim you were sexually assaulted? Defamation. Even if what you said is true, would you be willing to spend the money to go to court and try to fight a defamation lawsuit?

>Defamation is a great way for those with money to silence dissent and avoid any consequences.

Your comment seems to fit the profile of Brewdog, a UK based 'craft brewery'. They are known for deliberately courting controversy. The egregious examples include frivolous claims on trademarks, misogyny, bullying, harassment, amongst toe-curling and churlish behaviour, when they appeared on a BBC programme Who's The Boss. The latest 'Gold Can' escapade is another deceptive marketing campaign, which is their raison d'être. The strategy works, as it is doing them no harm and the growth is phenomenal.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jun/10/brewdog-pun...

https://www.thedrinksbusiness.com/2016/03/brewdog-boss-regre...

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-57650685

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damages is a legal term of art that implies a finding of fault in a judicial proceeding and a corresponding award by the court/arbitrator/etc. This is not that: no fault/guilt need be admitted (though it was here). It's just a contract to accept a certain amount of money and in exchange to not proceed with a lawsuit.

It's also an English word that can be used for the same kind of thing without the law being involved at all.

I see people make this absurd argument applied to various subjects constantly on HN.

So a guy hits a triple, should I then say, "wow that guy hit a home run" because in business meetings "hitting a home run" means "doing a good job".

Or can we agree that when talking about baseball we probably shouldn't use the term home run to mean good job because that would be incorrect in this context specific setting.

Well, using the word damages in the general sense but in relation to a legal case is the same thing as calling a triple a home run. It's wrong, because the context makes it wrong.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#106
post #87

Disclaimer: I have no idea who Stephen Nolan is, and I'm not aware of the context. The reaction is based solely on the article. I get a feeling that the light is only being shed on the side of the story which makes the "victim" look like an alpha male. All this "message" and "tracing" crap. I wonder how this "troll" was "traced". Specially trained Twitter-hound? You don't just "trace" people on the internet. They way…

> I wonder how this "troll" was "traced". Specially trained Twitter-hound? You don't just "trace" people on the internet.

Look up Kurt Eichenwald. He found and sued an anonymous Twitter troll who send him a GIF "you deserve a seizure" in 2017. I'm not sure exactly how, I think the authorities helped him, so Twitter just might've gave them the information.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#107
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it just has to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis. If someone anonymously tweets something knowingly false along the lines of "[X] is a rapist/pedophile and I have proof", I agree you should be able to sue that person. A false, defamatory accusation like that can easily ruin your career and life. But I can imagine plenty of things that someone could argue are defamatory which fall into a much grayer area wh…

That is an example that US defamation law would cover as well. For public figures, normally you have to demonstrate actual malice to win a defamation case. But there are certain things that are defamation per se, in other words are always considered defamation unless they're true. The list differs per state, but things like calling someone a pedophile is always on it. Fun fact: saying someone was gay used to be consi…

Right. Maybe I'm biased because I'm American, but I think the US defamation laws seem pretty reasonable. I'm curious to see the tweets so I can see how I feel about the UK's laws and enforcement.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#108

It should be noted: Stephen Nolan is a Northern Irish presenter, and the trolling in question concerned whether his show gives an unfair amount of coverage to unionist positions, as opposed to nationalists. Personal security concerns are a big deal in this case, regardless of whether the anonymous figure is well-known or not. Settling here isn't necessarily just a PR move.

Wow that introduces a whole different dimension to this. That makes it sound like the "trolling" may have been a legitimate political criticism (unfounded or not), and the "troll" paid out due to a threat to their personal safety. Even darker that the threat was made by the national broadcaster of the occupying nation.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#109
post #37

> The individual admitted running a campaign which "involved the systematic dissemination of false and defamatory allegations" against Mr Nolan. I think that it is good that someone got to own up for the turdslinging they do online, but why are we ok with platforms that aren’t held accountable for the “systematic dissemination of false and defamatory allegations” they enable? What if you don’t have BBC lawyers and re…

> I simply don’t get why we don’t hold the social media platforms accountable for the content that gets posted to them The scale of content being posted on social media is such that this liability makes running a social media platform effectively impossible. All user generated content would have to be manually reviewed before being posted. This would be prohibitively expensive. As for the Trump ban, freedom of speech…

> As for the Trump ban, freedom of speech also means freedom from compelled speech. The government can't force a store to sell a particular newspaper, or force a newspaper to run a particular story. Same applies to internet websites. If you have a blog with a comments section, the government can't force you to host certain comments.

I personally don’t find this argument particularly compelling when the entity in question is a platform that arguably has more influence over public discourse than most (all?) governments.

There is an enormous difference between someone’s blog and a web site that is used as a communication platform by politicians and world leaders, and which has a user base numbering in the millions or even billions.

Re: Twitter 'troll' to pay six-figure sum

#110

The title isn't a reasonable one: the very prejudicial descriptor 'troll' is language from lawyers from one side of a legal dispute. The BBC isn't credibly a neutral arbiter, because the litigant is one of their presenters. This is not taking any position on the underlying dispute (which is apparently about Northern Ireland politics [0]), nor is it a criticism of or specific to the BBC. [0] This Reddit discussion (pr…

It's the use of a quote mark in a headline that's always the problem. They should be banned.
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