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Modular Homes for Under $50k

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Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at this primarily on a cost per square foot basis seems like the famous slashdot mistake of 2 decades ago of dismissing the iPod because it had less memory than a shitty competitor. I mean, it's an ADU, designed to be small, but would basically have the same fixed costs (appliances, plumbing, electrical) of a house twice the size, and I'm sure the manufacturers could make a house twice the size with only a ma…

The headline touts cost, I think it's fair to look at the actual cost benefits. If Apple designed the iPod and promoted it based on cost Slashdot would have had a point. Apple never says 'hey look how affordable our product is'. This headline caught my eye as I'm interested in how the fuck people are going to afford homes in the near future. I am disappointed. The "home" is not somewhere young people can raise a fami…

I'm a single dude with two dogs. I currently have five bedroom house - downsizing into something like this is pretty appealing. And yes, my current house is overkill and I ended up in it for a bunch of reasons unique to me - even still the majority of houses in this area have at least three bedrooms and two bathrooms; there just aren't that many smaller houses that are worth the money - which is why people end up upsizing even if it may not be the best fit. I would like something a bit bigger than the studio they are profiling - at least something with two rooms. A separate bedroom would go a long way towards making this very practical for an even bigger swath of people. They are pitching this as additional living space to an existing property.

I hope they don't stop there because I think there is a huge need for simple two bedroom one bath or two bedroom one full and one half bath layouts for single people or couples where you can use the second bedroom as an office or guest room. Not everyone has herds of kids running around. Nor do I need separate formal living or dining rooms. And I absolutely do NOT need two stories. Stairs suck for everyone but the builders who get to pile more square footage onto smaller lots.

This looks to be their first foray into this kind of modular housing. I will be keeping an eye on them - if they do come out with something slightly bigger like I talk about above then I could be very interested. Indeed I'm thinking of moving and there is a decent lot in the community I'm looking at where a micro house like this would be perfect. Just prepare a slab with the utilities and call them in. It's very appealing.

Quality control is the biggest thing that this kind of housing solves and why I'm very keen on them being successful. I've got friends with modular homes where the modules (walls as units, entire smaller rooms, entire sections of the roof) are built in a factory and the results are a LOT more consistent and the houses go up a lot faster too. Speed of construction is significant. My current house was stick framed on site. The main subfloor in my current house was open to the elements for almost a month while it was under construction. I'm surprised my stairs look as good as they do as they were exposed for weeks too. The amount of time it takes before at least the roof sheathing goes up is pretty vexing. I was here every day as the house was being built and I got a pretty good framing crew (I also brought them snacks, water and a few cases of beer at the end of the day - building rapport with people goes a long way) - some of my neighbors who were more hands off had all kinds of structural issues later where stuff was framed wrong and wasn't caught by the building inspectors or their home inspectors. If people even bothered with a home inspector; I found one that used to be a building code inspector and he caught a load bearing wall that was under framed under my dining room - so even though I was scrutinizing the crap out of stuff and was here every day even I missed it. When you have the same components being made in factories - indoors out of the weather, on jigs with specialized tooling, etc. you get dramatically more consistent results.

Factory building modular components removes A TON of variables.

I could see them being able to design customizable and modular homes where you pick the various parts of your home and link them up - want three bedrooms instead of two or one? Pick a different mix of modules. Roofing would be the biggest challenge but there are probably some solutions there with a little creativity.

Next to a house, a car is the 2nd biggest purchase most people make - could you imagine if four different trades showed up over a few weeks with various parts and assembled a car in your driveway? It's kind of nuts when you think about it...

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with your point, but you should s/cost/memory to make your comparison analogous. Slashdot was dismissing the iPod because it had less storage than a Creative Nomad and other popular players of the time.

Well obviously comparing an iPod to a home is stupid in the first place. An iPod is a consumer product, where a home is a fundamental life component. Most people evaluate a home in terms of size, location, and cost alone. People will move into a dump if it's the right size, location, and cost. In other words, people have been happily living in Creative Nomads for centuries and this "iPod" home is not going to disrupt…

>The modular home does not innovate

factory construction alone is a huge innovation - and if they have figured out a way to solve some of the transportation and assembly issues in a creative way they will literally be solving the biggest barrier to factory home construction.

Factory constructed modules are far more consistent and can be of far higher quality that field construction. The biggest factor - your building indoors out of the weather! Factory constructed parts can be built on jigs, making the resulting product a lot higher quality and more consistent. Finally factory construction makes creating specialized tooling that speeds construction while increasing overall quality financially feasible.

The big bugaboo with factory construction is getting the thing from the factory to the job site - and that's something they have a new take on and is what's really exciting. Within the next year or so I will be looking for a new house. If I could get a lot and plop something like that on there I would love it.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#323
post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at this primarily on a cost per square foot basis seems like the famous slashdot mistake of 2 decades ago of dismissing the iPod because it had less memory than a shitty competitor. I mean, it's an ADU, designed to be small, but would basically have the same fixed costs (appliances, plumbing, electrical) of a house twice the size, and I'm sure the manufacturers could make a house twice the size with only a ma…

No, I don't think they could make it twice the size -- it has to unfold from a standard TEU size!

Why couldn't you place two (or more) modules next to each other?

Certainly beats bringing a pile of raw lumber to a job site and constructing crap from scratch in the open elements for a few months before you get it closed in!

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#324
post #269

This house is 375 sq ft and uses low end materials, and it doesn't include setup, so it's going to cost ~$100k, or $266 / sq ft. Most new home construction is more like $150 / sq ft. And with this system, you're very limited in what you can build. Who's the target customer for this?

Tiny houses have a large cost per square foot. One of the early forces in tiny houses remarked that his house was simultaneously the smallest in his city and the most expensive per square foot. Part of it is the cube square law's little brother, the "square linear law?" You have proportionately more wall for the enclosed area. On top of that you still have the expensive bits… bathrooms and kitchens.

And here is the prime example of perverse incentives when it comes to housing - particularly in the US. Only focusing on acquisition cost.

How about cost of utilities per square foot over 10 years? My money is on the smaller, vastly better constructed smaller home than traditional build to minimum code mass market crappy tract housing that dominates much of American suburbia.

Who lives in one house for the majority of their life any more? It's pretty rare. In my development it was only a few thousand more to double the insulation and convert to more efficient HVAC - less than half the people building a new house did it. Heck it was $750 to insulate the garage - maybe 1/3 did - you can tell because the people who did got insulated garage doors with windows. A neighbor across the street bought a house where the previous owner didn't insulate the garage. The master bedroom is over the garage. I asked him if his master bedroom got cold in the winter - he got wide eyed and said that as a matter of fact it did. I pointed out the insulation difference - he had a buddy come over and help him pull down the drywall in the garage, they insulated all the walls and added more to the ceiling and re-drywalled and the difference was night and day. Building codes tightened up quite a bit in 2010 so I think they force builders to do that insulation for everything now, but that's just one example of how people care more about granite countertops than paying attention to core infrastructure that could impact a building for it's entire life.

A pithier way to put it - much of your square footage discrepancy is from people sacrificing short term cost for long term costs we all pay for.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#325
post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tiny houses have a large cost per square foot. One of the early forces in tiny houses remarked that his house was simultaneously the smallest in his city and the most expensive per square foot. Part of it is the cube square law's little brother, the "square linear law?" You have proportionately more wall for the enclosed area. On top of that you still have the expensive bits… bathrooms and kitchens.

At that point, if you have the land for it, why not just go for an "efficiently sized" home. Like 500-700 sqft.

This is their first unit. If they keep going it sounds like they are planning to offer homes with more rooms. I hope so - If they had a two bedroom (so I can use the other bedroom as an office) one bath I'd be all over it.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#326
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same way a lot of products have become cheaper because of some process optimization (packaged more compactly to reduce transportation costs), I'm excited to see modular homes/home 3d-printing etc. play out and become cheaper over time until they are more affordable than convention home construction or somehow unique and better in ways that conventionally constructed homes cannot be. To answer your question, on…

The substack Construction Physics has an excellent overview of the now 100 year failed promise of modular building and the eternal cycles of the exact same value props being pitched in ambitious efforts to reform construction and why conventional construction has refused to be disrupted. Some great posts are: https://constructionphysics.substack.com/p/building-componen... https://constructionphysics.substack.com/p/op…

In what you linked first, his criticisms are (rightly) directed towards pre-fabed concrete. That's not this system.

This is a folded system - exactly what you indicate he's cautiously excited about. As am I. Let me link together two or three of those modules - say a living room/kitchen/laundry and two bedroom/bathroom modules. Would be perfect!

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#327
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Savings of time to build and use, can be removed as easily as it’s deployed.

$50k will buy a reasonably nice RV that includes wheels and a hitch and such options abound.

RV's have a ton of compromises to make them light that do not restrict this solution.

There is simply no comparison. Buying an RV to park it permanently would be daft.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>but their video shows a crane used to unfold it. By the time you get all the heavy machinery out there to prep the land and assemble the structure you're most of the way to just building something unique. This[0] Is[1] A[2] Solved[3] Problem[4] But many municipalities prohibit it because if you make housing too cheap the "wrong kind of people" might move in. In the desert you shouldn't have problems though. [0] http…

Isn't the insulation on those types of homes terrible?

It doesn't have to be. They have a video where he hits the exterior with a propane torch - not all construction materials are the same. These appear to be quite well constructed and as long as they have figured out how to prevent air infiltration at the joints once it's unfolded and fully assembled these should be far more energy efficient than the vast majority of tract housing being mass thrown up.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#329
post #228

This house is 375 sq ft and uses low end materials, and it doesn't include setup, so it's going to cost ~$100k, or $266 / sq ft. Most new home construction is more like $150 / sq ft. And with this system, you're very limited in what you can build. Who's the target customer for this?

The first idea that strikes me (aside form the obvious in-law apt addition) is to use this approach for the homeless. It's been shown that the best solution for many (non-mentally-ill) homeless is to literally provide a home. E.g., merely the fact of falling on enough hardships to lose a home and having no fixed address is a major impediment to getting a new job and becoming a homed, taxpaying resident. Yet I've read…

The main problem with homeless people is not a lack of housing, but that the vast majority of them want to be homeless. That this is even a controversial statement to many is the real tragedy holding back "solving" the homeless problem. In this area the only time there are shelter problems are when it gets too cold for them to realistically stay outside. And yes, the shelters do provide them with networking opportunities, fixed addresses, services to ensure they are clean and have good clothes for job interviews, etc. The majority are not interested. For a wide variety of reasons (and no, not all of them are healthy reasons) they like being independent and not tied to anyone or anything.

Simply providing someone a home and trying to stuff them in there is only a minuscule part of the overall issue.

Re: Modular Homes for Under $50k

#330
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So my question is, if you had a piece of land, concrete foundation, electrical, water and sewer connection, is it possible to get something better for 50k?

is it possible to get something better for 50k? If you are willing to do a lot of work yourself and value your time a $0 and aren't in a hurry, probably. Otherwise, this looks pretty good.

>If you are willing to do a lot of work yourself and value your time a $0 and aren't in a hurry, probably.

I wish I could vote you up more than once. If they are taking advantage of economies of scale they should be able to obtain for higher quality materials (and in looking over their materials this is not stuff they are buying at Home Depot). Couple that with the advantages of building all this stuff indoors, sheltered from the weather while under construction and that they can afford to create specialized jigs and tooling to not only speed the construction time but also produce far more consistent and higher quality results they should be able to do things that you simply can't do on site in the field.

Transportation of prefabbed housing has always been the major issue, which is why they spend so much time talking about how they are solving that :)

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