Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave • Hacker News Board

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#261

Post by BenjiWiebe » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:03 AM UTC

xyhopguy wrote: post #214

geocrasher wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't had the opportunity to look up the humidity in BC, but certainly it is far greater than what you would see in death valley. Death valley is a very dry area. The Pacific Northwest is wet and the humidity just adds to the misery of the heat. In my area we saw almost 110° at about 35% humidity. I have experienced 120° in 5% humidity and I have to say the 110 felt hotter! Definitely more miserable!

thats a dewpoint of 76F!!! dunno what its like a little more east but in the northwest that's unheard of. Portland's dewpoint I think peaked around 65F.

Here in central Kansas the dewpoint went over 80F two or three weeks ago.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#262

Post by state_less » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:06 AM UTC

jeroenhd wrote: post #210

state_less wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, solar is dirt cheap energy and you wouldn’t need much of a battery (or any?) in this case, since you can store the excess product water in a tank. I power my water maker with about 1400 watts and can make 35 gallons an hour. The panels, electronics and water maker were ~ $5000. I did the work myself at a slow pace, so not sure what the labor costs would be. I set my system up in about 2 weeks. The requirements a…

$5000 in a third world country is quite a lot. For context, according to CEIC data [1], the average salary in Algeria is about $300 per month. That "dirt cheap" project of yours is more than a year's worth of labor. Locally priced goods may be cheaper, but the US does benefit from a more direct shipping line with China (where most of these products come from, especially cheap solar panels). There's repair costs to be…

Yeah, it’s tough out there. I think the capital cost might be around $15 to $40 a month depending on how generous the lender is.

Evaporative is interesting too, but solar isn’t too bad to maintain. Most of the maintenance would probably be keeping the filters, pumps and membranes in working order.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#263

Post by throwitaway1235 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:09 AM UTC

angst_ridden wrote: post #155

throwitaway1235 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would first want to see the study confirming this current heat dome is a result of climate change.

And what would you accept as proof? Meteorological models showing the jet stream gets "wavier" with increased temperature?

I would accept as proof whatever evidence/studies climatologists suggest prove that this heat wave is a result of climate change.

Earth science should not be treated as religion.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#264

Post by m4rtink » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:19 AM UTC

stavros wrote: post #188

bin_bash wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solar doesn’t provide nearly as much energy and for desalination you need a surprising amount. Nuclear is a great use-case since the problem with nuclear is it needs a constant water source. If you’re desalinating you’ve got that problem covered.

Does nuclear need fresh water? I'd imagine salt water would wreck all the equipment, and you probably don't want to use up all the fresh water you generate...

You have heat exchangers between saltwater and clean freshwater that circulates through the sensitive parts of the plant.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#265

Post by cwkoss » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:43 AM UTC

fragbait65 wrote: post #170

cwkoss wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Population reduction advocates never seem to argue that themselves committing suicide would be the moral choice, which reveals they are valuing the preservation of their own current lifestyle over the lives of the "others". In practice, it seems like the majority of people who call for population reduction are white/western supremacists who lack empathy for humans born with less privilege. Birth control should be fre…

You are probably correct. I didn't really mean to suggest population control, even though I wrote just that. The problem as I see it is that everybody tries to approach the problem as if it will be solvable by technology. The only way I see that we can solve a climate crisis or the survival of humanity long term is to actually work together. Which I'm pretty certain will never happen, since there will always be greed…

I agree. I believe reducing wealth inequality is the best path towards stable global population. Nearly half of the countries in the world are already below the population replacement rate - and it seems birth rates are inversely correlated with wealth to some extent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_and_d...

If we can end war and poverty (and that's a pretty big 'if'), I think global population would stabilize and this would be a non-issue.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#266

Post by fragbait65 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:43 AM UTC

justshowpost wrote: post #251

nxc18 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Chinese have not been successful in getting people to have more children. Recent news is that they may be covering up for the early stages of population decline. https://www.reuters.com/world/china/china-report-first-popul... Beyond that, the consensus is that population will naturally plateau in the near future, no need for killing people you don’t like. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/06/17/worlds-po…

Huh? Communist China was (and still is) aiming to have LESS children. Before 2015 they didn't allow more than 1 (one!) child per family. Currently they are allowing 2 (two) children which is below sustainability threshold of 2.4

Current news suggest that they are upping the threshold to 3 children trying to stimulate population growth due to needing to increase their available work force in the future.

These measures are not as extreme as the last time they stimulated their population growth, which lead to the one child policy. We'll see if they feel that this stimulation is enough or if they will try to increase the incentive even more if they don't feel as if it is enough.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#267

Post by state_less » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:45 AM UTC

Johnny555 wrote: post #233

state_less wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, solar is dirt cheap energy and you wouldn’t need much of a battery (or any?) in this case, since you can store the excess product water in a tank. I power my water maker with about 1400 watts and can make 35 gallons an hour. The panels, electronics and water maker were ~ $5000. I did the work myself at a slow pace, so not sure what the labor costs would be. I set my system up in about 2 weeks. The requirements a…

That seems like a lot of cost and complexity for a rural installation in a 3rd world country. How does the water output compare with, say, spending $1000 a simple evaporation design? The size of the evaporation pool would be larger than 1400W worth of solar, but it's much simpler and easy to repair.

I agree there is more complexity, but it may be worth it. Making electricity buys a good deal of versatility. If you have a bit extra, you can run an inductive burner, charge your phone/laptop or charge a house battery (if/when you can afford one).

I think in either system, teaching the locals to setup the system and maintain it themselves is important for keeping the costs down.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#268

Post by Johnny555 » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:57 AM UTC

state_less wrote: post #267

Johnny555 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like a lot of cost and complexity for a rural installation in a 3rd world country. How does the water output compare with, say, spending $1000 a simple evaporation design? The size of the evaporation pool would be larger than 1400W worth of solar, but it's much simpler and easy to repair.

I agree there is more complexity, but it may be worth it. Making electricity buys a good deal of versatility. If you have a bit extra, you can run an inductive burner, charge your phone/laptop or charge a house battery (if/when you can afford one). I think in either system, teaching the locals to setup the system and maintain it themselves is important for keeping the costs down.

But my question is, what's the cost benefit?

$1000 would buy a pretty large solar still and you can spend the extra $4000 on a solar phone charger if that's something the locals need. Meanwhile there's little that can go wrong with a solar still and if something does go wrong, they can likely fix it (even if temporarily) with duct tape. Losing their cell phone charger and cooktop to electrical failure sounds like less of a problem than losing their water source.

An inductive burner, cell phone charger, desalinator, etc all sound great on a $200,000 boat where the owner is wealthy enough to keep it maintained and probably keep spares. But putting expensive and complicated electronics in a village so remote that they don't even have reliable water seems like a mistake.

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#269

Post by koyote » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 1:58 AM UTC

bin_bash wrote: post #163

_ph_ wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't solar be much better for powering desalination than nuclear power? It is way cheaper per energy produced than nuclear, especially in those countries, which need desalination most. Also, it doesn't take a decade to set up. Not even mentioning proliferation issues.

Solar doesn’t provide nearly as much energy and for desalination you need a surprising amount. Nuclear is a great use-case since the problem with nuclear is it needs a constant water source. If you’re desalinating you’ve got that problem covered.

The Sydney desalination plant is entirely powered by Wind:

https://www.sydneydesal.com.au/caring-for-the-environment/10...

Re: Heat dome causing record breaking heat wave

#270

Post by bch » Thu, Jul 01, 2021, 2:01 AM UTC

geocrasher wrote: post #174

JKCalhoun wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, that's Death Valley hot.

I haven't had the opportunity to look up the humidity in BC, but certainly it is far greater than what you would see in death valley. Death valley is a very dry area. The Pacific Northwest is wet and the humidity just adds to the misery of the heat. In my area we saw almost 110° at about 35% humidity. I have experienced 120° in 5% humidity and I have to say the 110 felt hotter! Definitely more miserable!

As pointed out below it’s a pretty arid geography, but things just got worse for Lytton - an evacuation order for the village has been ordered[0][1] and “the whole town is on fire”[2] according to the mayor.

(Edit: links)

[0] https://twitter.com/tnrd/status/1410415425146458114?s=21

[1] https://twitter.com/emergencyinfobc/status/14104142964507484...

[2] https://twitter.com/cbctanya/status/1410415894979698689?s=21