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Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

v2.onivim.io

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Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#121

Post by TheFreim »

vimacs2 wrote: post #116
TheFreim wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snappyness is definitely something emacs lacks. Usually it doesn't bother me, but sometimes I know what I want to do and it gets in the way. I'm definitely. Interested in onivim2, I'll probably compile at some point and check it out.

For me, my Emacs runs fine up till I try using lsp for java development and then it's a bloody nightmare. Currently, I'm being forced to resort to the indignity that is Eclipse as a result of that. I'm frankly ready for a total reimagining of Emacs even if it means that extension support might be compromised for a while. The last time there was a major divide, we had XEmacs and a lot of the massive improvements that…

I've had good luck with meghanada mode for Java development but I still stick with idea most of the time (mainly because I haven't set up binds to build or do things automatically yet). Still, I have issues with emacs as an IDE sometimes. For example when doing python, I forget the backend I'm using right now, after having it running for a while a ton of processes start to get spun up and it stops being able to properly do code completions. I'm sure I could solve these problems, I just haven't yet since I usually restart emacs often anyways.

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#122

Post by vimacs2 »

I managed to build it and test it a little bit and damn, it's not just marketing to describe it as having an insanely fast start up time. It launched almost as quick as I can spawn new client windows from my Emacs daemon and scrolling and text editing seems to be buttery smooth as well.

However, I really don't like the fact that there is no way to navigate tabs using vim's commands.

I also find the VSCode similarities distracting and it seems to be causing confusion to would be investors of this due to the assumption it's some branch of it as opposed to a completely new editor.

Finally, is there a way to remove the system bar on the top in the configuration? I can toggle most elements of the UI but that system bar is visible even in zen mode and I never use it in any text editor with support for keyboard driven commands.

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#123

Post by zbaylin »

chimen wrote: post #107
tuananh wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the source code is available here https://github.com/onivim/oni2

Saw it but didn't find anything. I guess it's a complete re-implementation of the UI. The comments seem to suggest that as well.

Yeah the UI is completely custom built using Revery (a custom-built Electron alternative). Similarities to VSCode are just a result of it being the main inspiration. I would say Sublime also has a large influence on our design, i.e. in the minimap

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#124

Post by vimacs2 »

nsonha wrote: post #119
vimacs2 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it should ever be on by default but I do find it useful situationally, when scrolling through very large files (which ideally you want to avoid in your codebase in the first place) and when I don't necessarily have a specific search term or keyword in mind.

> I don't think it should ever be on by default Yet every single one of them has it on by default (not even autohide by default). As if they're afraid the user finds out how useless it is.

You're overthinking this. It's on by default because many users now expect it and it's surprising (at least to me as an Emacs user) how little people tend to dive into configuring their editors.

I guess it also looks kind of neat.

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#125

Post by lasagnaphil »

vimacs2 wrote: post #114
lasagnaphil wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Though it's incredibly painstaking to do a source build; at least in my Arch setup it needed about 20GB of disk space and a lot of time and patience (it needs the Ocaml compiler and also downloads a ton of NPM dependencies!!!), and the PKGBUILD script failed due to a reason I've yet to figure out. I was thinking about trying out Onivim someday but this one thing was the whole dealbreaker. I thought that if your progr…

> I was thinking about trying out Onivim someday but this one thing was the whole dealbreaker. I thought that if your program is advertised to be light and fast it would also be easy to build, but welp that's unfortunately not the case. This is not really a reasonable expectation to have for non-free software. The software is made for those willing to pay the licensing fee to download a prebuilt binary, not those tha…

I am actually willing to pay it if I can try a demo of it beforehand and confirm that it’s good (like I have paid for Sublime Merge). The problem is that I can’t try it without paying first.

(And I’m also disappointed at the fact that a software that strives for fastness and lightness is so much of a monstrous hassle to build. This has nothing to do with free/non-free software.)

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#126

Post by zbaylin »

lasagnaphil wrote: post #72
pharke wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the startup time is amazing. You can build from source if you want to try it out without paying. I bought a license and I've been using it on and off for personal projects but it is still in development so don't expect everything to be perfect. Still really good though, actually feels like (is) Vim with a modern UI.

Though it's incredibly painstaking to do a source build; at least in my Arch setup it needed about 20GB of disk space and a lot of time and patience (it needs the Ocaml compiler and also downloads a ton of NPM dependencies!!!), and the PKGBUILD script failed due to a reason I've yet to figure out. I was thinking about trying out Onivim someday but this one thing was the whole dealbreaker. I thought that if your progr…

I wrote a reddit post[0] about why Oni takes so much space to build, but the TLDR is that we build a bunch of native libraries from scratch on a fresh build, namely Skia.

I would like to note that we don’t maintain/support/promote the Oni package on AUR. Builds from scratch are mostly for “trial” or contribution purposes. We do try to help with build issues in the Discord, though!

I would also disagree with the idea that a light and fast program must be easy/quick to build. C++ is notorious for having huge resource/time requirements to compile, but the end result (assuming good code) can be faster than some C code! Consequently, it takes relatively little time to spin up a node interpreter but the resulting program is orders of magnitude slower.

Oni is written in OCaml, so naturally it requires the OCaml compiler to build. Those NPM packages aren’t JS — we just leverage the existing NPM ecosystem for our native code.

We do recognize that building from scratch is not ideal, which is why we provide prebuilt binaries for purchase. I can’t give an exact timeline, but we’ve discussed publishing public trial builds probably before the end of the year, which further reduces the need to build from scratch.

Feel free to ask any other questions in the Discord!

[0] https://reddit.com/r/onivim/comments/n05pqz/_/gw8hw8p/?conte...

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#127

Post by zbaylin »

vimacs2 wrote: post #115
zbaylin wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey, Onivim contributor here! I think Oni is in a hard place where it’s the primary source of income for Outrun Labs. Oni is open source in two senses - the source is available online (technically doesn’t meet some definitions of open source, but the source is open) - we MIT commits after 18 months. In terms of contributors retaining rights to the product, we do have a bug bounty program where if you fix a bug with a…

Just so I understand this correctly, the version of Onivim 2 from 18 months ago will be open source? That's not the worst solution if true. John Carmack would do something similar with many of his game engines back when he was working with Id Tech (albeit with a much longer lag time).

Yep! You can find the MIT repo here: https://github.com/onivim/oni2-mit

I actually never thought of it in the context of Id Software, that’s an interesting comparison!

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#128

Post by mdaniel »

gryn wrote: post #7
a3w wrote: post #2

Buying software without a trial makes me disinterested. I still want to learn using vim every day, but won't commit to this text editor/vsx-powered IDE, unless I find out that I have the guts to use it every day. Also, there is VIM mode for VS Code, I guess.

it seems to be open source there's a link in the page to the project's GitHub page. https://github.com/onivim/oni2

Pedantically, I believe it's closer to "source available" than open source, since their license specifically adds a lot of restrictions on the end user

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#129

Post by mdaniel »

lasagnaphil wrote: post #125
vimacs2 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was thinking about trying out Onivim someday but this one thing was the whole dealbreaker. I thought that if your program is advertised to be light and fast it would also be easy to build, but welp that's unfortunately not the case. This is not really a reasonable expectation to have for non-free software. The software is made for those willing to pay the licensing fee to download a prebuilt binary, not those tha…

I am actually willing to pay it if I can try a demo of it beforehand and confirm that it’s good (like I have paid for Sublime Merge). The problem is that I can’t try it without paying first. (And I’m also disappointed at the fact that a software that strives for fastness and lightness is so much of a monstrous hassle to build. This has nothing to do with free/non-free software.)

There's a middle ground: they have a cloud based build descriptors (currently reporting as failing, but exists), so one could make use of GitHub's disk and cpu if dedicating that much of a local computer is annoying

Re: Onivim 2 is a retro-futuristic modal editor

#130

Post by TheFreim »

twobitshifter wrote: post #39
TheFreim wrote: post #34

What does this offer that evil-mode emacs, or even vscode, has to offer...?

If every text editor has to implement full emacs functionality, every alternate text editor project should just stop now.

Having something to offer != implementing every single feature of emacs. Sometimes NOT having all the stuff emacs has can be a good decision.
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