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Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#71

Post by bluejekyll »

exporectomy wrote: post #70
flamble wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I found so frustrating about the comment was how close it was to some sort of insight, while maddeningly not connecting the dots. He has some vague sense that his unhappiness is related to "workaholism", but is so fixated on gender politics that he twists it to revolve around that. He imagines that women have a "choice of careers, choice of being a mother while the husband provides", apparently oblivious to the…

Feminism was just one of the several things he said. There are plenty of zero-income families - single mothers. So single-income families are surely even more possible. Usually only women have this choice. Men can't choose family over career.

> Men can't choose family over career.

I’m not sure why you think this. I have quite a few friends and families in my circle where the women are the primary breadwinners of the family. Let alone the number of two-mother and two-father households. In almost all cases dual-incomes are the norm.

When you say, “men can’t choose family”, who’s preventing that?

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#72

Post by BurningFrog »

mkr-hn wrote: post #26
raxxorrax wrote: post #10

My impression was that more and more people withdraw because the "public" has become quite toxic.

There's definitely an element of the last several years revealing how many people are just awful human beings. I'm wary of spending time getting to know someone only to find out they think certain people (like me) don't deserve equal rights, or something like that. I know on some level people were always like that. Bad ideas are pervasive and always have been. But there's more echo chambers reinforcing bad ideas now.…

We used to ostracise the obnoxious and crazy. That meant we never had to deal with them.

Now everyone is on social media, and it turns out including the obnoxious and crazy turns society insane.

So... - and I hate every word that follows - maybe ostracising was a necessary evil, and needs to be reinvented.

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#73

Post by mkr-hn »

BurningFrog wrote: post #72
mkr-hn wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's definitely an element of the last several years revealing how many people are just awful human beings. I'm wary of spending time getting to know someone only to find out they think certain people (like me) don't deserve equal rights, or something like that. I know on some level people were always like that. Bad ideas are pervasive and always have been. But there's more echo chambers reinforcing bad ideas now.…

We used to ostracise the obnoxious and crazy. That meant we never had to deal with them. Now everyone is on social media, and it turns out including the obnoxious and crazy turns society insane. So... - and I hate every word that follows - maybe ostracising was a necessary evil, and needs to be reinvented.

The science I've skimmed/read summaries of shows that ostracism just makes people dig their heels in. At best, it makes them quiet outside their bubbles, but it doesn't change how they vote or who they donate to. I don't just want them to shut up. I want to shut off the pipeline into the bubbles and make sure there's a way out.

You might not be surprised to learn I also favor restorative justice over retributive justice.

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#74

Post by schrijver »

exporectomy wrote: post #70
flamble wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I found so frustrating about the comment was how close it was to some sort of insight, while maddeningly not connecting the dots. He has some vague sense that his unhappiness is related to "workaholism", but is so fixated on gender politics that he twists it to revolve around that. He imagines that women have a "choice of careers, choice of being a mother while the husband provides", apparently oblivious to the…

Feminism was just one of the several things he said. There are plenty of zero-income families - single mothers. So single-income families are surely even more possible. Usually only women have this choice. Men can't choose family over career.

How does that work? You get money just for being a mother?

At least the way it works in the countries I’ve lived in is that if you’re on the dole it doesn’t matter if you’re a mother (or a father for that matter)—you still have the obligation to find a job.

And as a man you can totally chose family over career, in the same way that women do. There’s a social stigma against it, of course. And it can be economically difficult—but that’s the case for women as well.

Of course, the pressure for a man to act as a provider and to focus on his career is very real. I think laurent92 isn’t wrong about the pressures men face. It’s weird though to blame that on feminism. I think feminism already helped chip away at the pressure. A stay-at-home dad should be acceptable to a feminist, more so than to someone who never gave pause to these questions. But in the end, it’s not feminism’s job to take care of men’s mental health, that’s really something that requires a movement of its own.

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#75

Post by [deleted] »

exporectomy wrote: post #70
flamble wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I found so frustrating about the comment was how close it was to some sort of insight, while maddeningly not connecting the dots. He has some vague sense that his unhappiness is related to "workaholism", but is so fixated on gender politics that he twists it to revolve around that. He imagines that women have a "choice of careers, choice of being a mother while the husband provides", apparently oblivious to the…

Feminism was just one of the several things he said. There are plenty of zero-income families - single mothers. So single-income families are surely even more possible. Usually only women have this choice. Men can't choose family over career.

[deleted]

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#76

Post by jansan »

flamble wrote: post #60
_notathrowaway wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel bad about you man, and I wish people in this website could recognize your experience rather than simply downvote it because it is not aligned with their political views.

What I found so frustrating about the comment was how close it was to some sort of insight, while maddeningly not connecting the dots. He has some vague sense that his unhappiness is related to "workaholism", but is so fixated on gender politics that he twists it to revolve around that. He imagines that women have a "choice of careers, choice of being a mother while the husband provides", apparently oblivious to the…

Just the other day I read a comment from a single mother with three children who just sent her children back to school after 15 months of home schooling. Her comment indicated that her views on society did not improve much during the pandemic, either, no workaholism required.

Society has very openly displayed its disrespect for certain groups of people during the pandemic, he clearly has a point there.

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#77

Post by [deleted] »

laurent92 wrote: post #35

Since lockdowns, I hate everybody. I just broke up with the idea that we are a society. No, we’re just insane people who are eating at other people’s sanity, using lockdowns as a means to dismantle our fellow citizen. How to become homeless when you start millionaire and CEO of a small/moderate company? Well this is the first and main step, because on any major problem, you are alone and no-one is going to testify in…

[deleted]

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#78

Post by tasuki »

BurningFrog wrote: post #54
toomanybeersies wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed that the BBC has been churning out a good number of "loneliness epidemic" articles for a few years now (since before covid). I haven't noticed this trend in any other publications that I read. I have no idea why they've been doing this. To be honest, I haven't looked further into it, and maybe I'm just noticing a pattern where there is none. But it's a thought that's crossed my mind a few times now.

UK now has a loneliness minister: https://time.com/5248016/tracey-crouch-uk-loneliness-ministe... She is not the only one.

> She is not the only one.

Is that done to prevent her loneliness?

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#79

Post by da_big_ghey »

yummypaint wrote: post #56
laurent92 wrote: post #35

Since lockdowns, I hate everybody. I just broke up with the idea that we are a society. No, we’re just insane people who are eating at other people’s sanity, using lockdowns as a means to dismantle our fellow citizen. How to become homeless when you start millionaire and CEO of a small/moderate company? Well this is the first and main step, because on any major problem, you are alone and no-one is going to testify in…

It sounds like you can afford therapy, you should strongly consider it. They can probably help you deal with your problems in a way that doesn't externalize your negative experiences onto others. If everything is someone else's fault, then there is so cause for self improvement and you will remain stuck where you are.

But here we are having problems caused by externals? Government coerceing me for to stay only in my house solely is external? So no «externalize»?

Re: Loneliness a 'bigger health risk than smoking or obesity'

#80

Post by tasuki »

laurent92 wrote: post #35

Since lockdowns, I hate everybody. I just broke up with the idea that we are a society. No, we’re just insane people who are eating at other people’s sanity, using lockdowns as a means to dismantle our fellow citizen. How to become homeless when you start millionaire and CEO of a small/moderate company? Well this is the first and main step, because on any major problem, you are alone and no-one is going to testify in…

> Men work themselves till death while women enjoy choice

As a man, isn't the "work themselves till death" part also a choice? Women enjoy all the choices you listed, sure, but what prevents the man from enjoying his choices? A man is likewise free to do anything.

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