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The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

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Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#91

Post by djbebs »

bassman9000 wrote: post #61
roelschroeven wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the thing is, what if you produce feta with the exact same ingredients and recipe in Australia? The customer gets the exact same thing, only made somewhere else. I'm all for quality standards, so that customers can now exactly what they get. But be able to use a name based on the location where something is produced, that doesn't protect the customer at all. It only protects a selected set of producers.

But the thing is, what if you produce feta with the exact same ingredients and recipe in Australia? The customer gets the exact same thing, only made somewhere else. You can't replicate weather and other local conditions, specially on foods that require precise humidity/temp control, even air quality. So it's not the same thing. That's the whole point of geographical.

If you put it to the test you would be very hard pressed to find and identifiable difference, just like wine experts can't tell a 5$ wine from a 500$ wine

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#92

Post by Symbiote »

dantheman wrote: post #85
dirtyid wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe time for neutral WHO naming conventions to apply. Champagne is officially F.5.231 or something inane that confers little marketing benefit.

Just put where it's manufactured on the label - that's really all that matters.

That is literally what Champagne is: the name of a place in France.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Champagne_(province)

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#93

Post by dantheman »

alkonaut wrote: post #59
unishark wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like that would still include all foods that have been around a long time in old countries. Such as sushi for Japan.

Possibly, but “dishes” and “exportable products” seem a bit different from an industrial perspective. I don’t think dishes will ever be up for discussion in this context.

Why not just put where it is manufactured? then you can support the place? don't they already do that?

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#94

Post by seszett »

dantheman wrote: post #87
ginko wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the point of PDOs though. That they are essentially a form of trademark.

But it's not a trademark - it's a location. Can beef made outside of England be called beef? Can any english name for food be used outside of England? Can french onion soup be sold outside of France?

Beef made outside of England can be called beef, but not English beef, which is the point of protected geographical indications (although this case doesn't need PGI, it's already protected under other laws regarding the indications of the origin of products).

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#95

Post by Symbiote »

newnamenewface wrote: post #81
TravelPiglet wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not call it something else and it would sell equally well on its own merits? You are basically given a better starting position because of the association with the name Feta, Champagne or Cognac. If Nike, the North face or some other trademark owner moves production to a different factory, you can’t continue production of the same goods even if the quality is the same. The GI and trademark name translates to extr…

Yes, but certain things are no more owned by one country or region than the world due to the dispersive nature of culture. If a Greek moves to the US and starts making feta there (say, even with the same milk fermenting bacteria), it's still feta, unless it's truly believed that national character imparts flavor. What then becomes the difference if a Greek teaches another how to make feta and they do it elsewhere? Or…

If an employee of Nike, at whatever level, leaves the company to make their own shoes, they can no longer use the Nike trademark to market them.

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#96

Post by dantheman »

alkonaut wrote: post #83
rhn_mk1 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would make that a tragedy? If the production of Parmesan in Italy is an important cultural phenomenon, then it can be preserved using other means, even non-economical ones.

It seems more genuine to have it remain a business/industry and not a museum. I quite like having genuine Parmesan from the right place. I’m happy to see any amount of ham fisted protectionism to keep it that way too. So to me it’s an easy win.

So all you have to do is look at where it where it was made on the label -- is that too difficult?

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#97

Post by anoncake »

bawolff wrote: post #64
anoncake wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone is willing to pay extra for an identical product because it's made by a more famous company they have only themselves to blame.

Have you met humans? Most status-symbols are all about the brand name, identical products made by other people don't count. And im ok with that. If someone makes a shitty knock-off,i dont think the original manufacturer should get the blame.

> shitty knock-off

I wrote "identical"

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#98

Post by anoncake »

iso1210 wrote: post #80
anoncake wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone is willing to pay extra for an identical product because it's made by a more famous company they have only themselves to blame.

Sure, it's also their choice. I wouldn't buy Nike trainers or Levi jeans, but I'm sure some people do, and by taking away that choice you are stealing from them.

What choice am I taking away from them?

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#99

Post by slightwinder »

throw0101a wrote: post #34
greatgib wrote: post #9

> The wording is strange, it looks like they say that it is wrong to say that it is inauthentic. But, there is no doubt, if you buy Greek feta that is manufactured in Australia in addition with different recipes and ingredients origins, it is clearly inauthentic and deceptive.

> But, there is no doubt, if you buy Greek feta that is manufactured in Australia in addition with different recipes and ingredients origins, it is clearly inauthentic and deceptive. There is pizza. There is New York (style) pizza, Chicago (style) pizza, Detroit, Montreal, etc. Each of those (styles) can be made anywhere. There's no reason why Chicago-style (deep-dish) pizza couldn't be made in London. Beside the phy…

Pizza is a dish with limited lifetime. It wouldn't be practible to link it to a location. And is there anything specific about the different styles that linkes them to the location?

With ingredients you have the specific local conditions, namely the plants, animals, soil, weather, which all influence the outcome. Additionally there is also the local knowledge, traditions and laws which influence the endresult.

And finally we also have the reason where there are patents, copyrights and trademarks in the first place. People invest time and money to bring a product to fame, and it's kinda unfair and sometimes even harmful if you allow anyone to just highjack the success and sell your own inferiour product under their fame.

> There are similar 'feta-style' cheese found in many other places:

Indeed, but similar is not the same.

A negative example in that regard would be wasabi. The original japanese wasabi is hardly available outside of japan. Yet most people believe that the fake-wasabi is the real thing and that they experience the authentic taste of japanese dishes (mostly sushi).

Re: The EU’s disputed system of geographical indications is taking over the planet (2017)

#100

Post by anoncake »

iso1210 wrote: post #71
anoncake wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can use the same recipes in Australia as in Greece. Ingredients could be tricky, but let's assume that you can make sheep milk in Australia that has the same properties as Greek sheep milk. Then why should it matter where the feta has been manufactured?

Lets assume you can make a trainer in exactly the same way as Adidas do, can you stick Adidas on the side? No, it's a trademark. That's effectively what PGI is, and unlike patents and copyright, trademarks have a direct benefit to the consumer (they know what they are getting. Nobody is stopping people buying a Gutchy handbag, but the selling can't pass it off as Gucci) Same with "100% Florida orange juice" or "Idaho…

> Lets assume you can make a trainer in exactly the same way as Adidas do, can you stick Adidas on the side?

I absolutely should. What I obviously shouldn't be allowed to do is claim it's actually made by Adidas.

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