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Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

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Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#41

Post by MattGaiser »

Hamuko wrote: post #35
chrisseaton wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I want a chat service with native apps But why? 'Native' is a tool, not a goal, surely? What's the underlying goal you want to achieve, and do you really need native to achieve that?

> What's the underlying goal you want to achieve Performance, small bundle sizes and native UI widgets. And judging by all of the Electron apps failing in these departments, I guess you really do need native apps.

> small bundle sizes

Space are not precious anymore. Nor is bandwidth.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#42

Post by dreyfan »

slashdev wrote: post #29
richardstephens wrote: post #7

Drop Electron.... for Edge Webview2. I mean, okay sure, half the memory is an improvement. But what is going on in the chat industry that everyone's converged on Electron? You'd think Microsoft of all companies would be able to figure out how to build native apps. If I want a chat service with native apps, it seems like my only option is IRC.

Native apps means essentially building at least 5 distinct apps: windows, mac, iOS, linux, android. What a mess to work with and maintain. We already have cross-platfrom UI engines called browsers and they're very advanced and reasonably pleasant to work with these days. If you bundle the browser (electron) then you don't have to worry about differences between browsers. So electron makes plenty of sense to developer…

Microsoft is a $2T company, I feel like they could afford to do it right.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#43

Post by Hamuko »

MattGaiser wrote: post #41
Hamuko wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What's the underlying goal you want to achieve Performance, small bundle sizes and native UI widgets. And judging by all of the Electron apps failing in these departments, I guess you really do need native apps.

> small bundle sizes Space are not precious anymore. Nor is bandwidth.

Says who? A Surface Laptop 4 comes with a 256 GB SSD. And the Surface Pro 7 comes with a 128 GB SSD.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#44

Post by bloopernova »

Not really relevant but I need to vent.

Client dropped Slack for Teams. I hate it, and information exchange has dropped precipitously since everyone switched. So slow, half the time text markup doesn't work, and the UI is inconsistent depending on if you're typing in a chat, meeting, or channel.

Oh and none of the Slack logs were kept, losing years of information. (But that's not the fault of the Teams software)

I loathe Teams.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#45

Post by BLKNSLVR »

Teams sucks.

It's user interface is unintuitive and messy. I find it difficult to find the context I want.

Search doesn't seem to work.

It takes a long time to load.

When it eventually loads, it pops itself up in front of whatever I've opened and started working on (whilst Teams is busy loading) to take all my keystrokes until I notice the keystrokes aren't showing up in the program I was already using - I've seen at least one person's password entered into a chat session because of Teams "grabbing the front".

And, finally, Teams has taken the initiative to redefine "full screen" such that even that unambiguous terminology is now meaningless. Full screen now means "zoom in, just a little bit". Fuck you Teams.

Screen sharing / video conferencing works fine, however. Except the full screen thing, so even the decent bit has a large caveat.

My apologies for the outburst, but I had to get it off my chest. Teams fucking sucks.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#46

Post by richardstephens »

chrisseaton wrote: post #24
richardstephens wrote: post #7

Drop Electron.... for Edge Webview2. I mean, okay sure, half the memory is an improvement. But what is going on in the chat industry that everyone's converged on Electron? You'd think Microsoft of all companies would be able to figure out how to build native apps. If I want a chat service with native apps, it seems like my only option is IRC.

> If I want a chat service with native apps But why? 'Native' is a tool, not a goal, surely? What's the underlying goal you want to achieve, and do you really need native to achieve that?

For me personally, it's having a set of UI widgets as consistent as possible with everything else on the platform as the primary concern. Secondarily it's performance / battery life.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#47

Post by hughrr »

dreyfan wrote: post #42
slashdev wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native apps means essentially building at least 5 distinct apps: windows, mac, iOS, linux, android. What a mess to work with and maintain. We already have cross-platfrom UI engines called browsers and they're very advanced and reasonably pleasant to work with these days. If you bundle the browser (electron) then you don't have to worry about differences between browsers. So electron makes plenty of sense to developer…

Microsoft is a $2T company, I feel like they could afford to do it right.

Apparently they favour fucking it up several times.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#48

Post by vletal »

slashdev wrote: post #29
richardstephens wrote: post #7

Drop Electron.... for Edge Webview2. I mean, okay sure, half the memory is an improvement. But what is going on in the chat industry that everyone's converged on Electron? You'd think Microsoft of all companies would be able to figure out how to build native apps. If I want a chat service with native apps, it seems like my only option is IRC.

Native apps means essentially building at least 5 distinct apps: windows, mac, iOS, linux, android. What a mess to work with and maintain. We already have cross-platfrom UI engines called browsers and they're very advanced and reasonably pleasant to work with these days. If you bundle the browser (electron) then you don't have to worry about differences between browsers. So electron makes plenty of sense to developer…

Most UI developers I know says that it's "reasonably pleasant", yet the is a shortage of "reasonably good" web developers on the market.

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#49

Post by Mary-Jane »

Bancakes wrote: post #27
MattGaiser wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Native anything is a lot of work for not a lot of gain as most users of Teams are forced to have it.

These are trillion dollar companies, I'm sure they can afford to lead the software industry for the greater good.

What 'greater good' can possibly be achieved by having to literally write the same app 5 different times?

Re: Microsoft Teams 2 will use half the memory, dropping Electron for Edge Webview2

#50

Post by richardstephens »

slashdev wrote: post #29
richardstephens wrote: post #7

Drop Electron.... for Edge Webview2. I mean, okay sure, half the memory is an improvement. But what is going on in the chat industry that everyone's converged on Electron? You'd think Microsoft of all companies would be able to figure out how to build native apps. If I want a chat service with native apps, it seems like my only option is IRC.

Native apps means essentially building at least 5 distinct apps: windows, mac, iOS, linux, android. What a mess to work with and maintain. We already have cross-platfrom UI engines called browsers and they're very advanced and reasonably pleasant to work with these days. If you bundle the browser (electron) then you don't have to worry about differences between browsers. So electron makes plenty of sense to developer…

I see where you're coming from, but Microsoft already builds an entire office sweet as native apps across 4 of the 5 platforms you enumerated.
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