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U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

washingtonpost.com

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Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#32

What is the goal of this campain to re-introduce aliens into the public discourse? Interestingly, it seems that the "smart" people are now falling for it (washington post, hn, certain subreddits and podcasts...).

>What is the goal of this campain to re-introduce aliens into the public discourse

To what end?

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What part of... rules out aliens? Because 1) Ruling _in_ aliens requires proof. Insisting that this specific scenario be ruled out is classic "shifting the burden of proof" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(philosophy) The train of thought that "we don't know what we saw, so ... aliens!" is somewhere between wishful and nutty. Extra-ordinary claims require extra-ordinary proof. 2) claiming that it's _d…

re #2: what's odd is that it is equipment failure that's been occurring for decades . One would hope that JIRA ticket wouldn't keep getting pushed back to the next sprint for 40+ years.

That assumes it can be easily fixed, or is the same cause every time.

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#34

What is the goal of this campain to re-introduce aliens into the public discourse? Interestingly, it seems that the "smart" people are now falling for it (washington post, hn, certain subreddits and podcasts...).

I doubt that. The interesting part is that there _is_ a goal even if we don't know what it is:

* US Government is telling the truth - goal may be to figure out what these are.

* US Government is lying - goal may be to mislead an adversary.

Those are just two examples. I find UFOs interesting because its hard to understand the government's intention here and fun to speculate.

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intelligence Agencies are designed to deceive. That's their primary function. It is completely within the realm of possibility that this is some psyop, ploy for funding, or tool designed to throw off some foreign adversary about our technical capabilities.

> Intelligence Agencies are designed to deceive. No, their primary function is to acquire information useful to decisions makers, including info others want to keep secret. Counterintelligence agencies, which are sometimes conjoined to intelligence agencies and sometimes separate have a primary function of preventing information that decisionmakers want to remain secret from being discovered. Deception is frequently…

Yes. But the USA doesn't have designated counterintelligence agencies. They're consistently referred to strictly as intelligence agencies. So it's important to clarify that the counterintelligence role is there even if it's not directly identified.

And, no their primary function is not to acquire information. Their primary funtion is to push and pull "information" to acheive the goals of The Republic. It's chess, not checkers.

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#36

This is a poor title. What part of advanced technology and flying at considerable speed without discernable means of propulsion rules out aliens? Aliens weren't confirmed, or even mentioned, but my reading of the report is that aliens are more likely an explanation than I thought them to be yesterday, not less.

> What part of... rules out aliens? Because 1) Ruling _in_ aliens requires proof. Insisting that this specific scenario be ruled out is classic "shifting the burden of proof" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burden_of_proof_(philosophy) The train of thought that "we don't know what we saw, so ... aliens!" is somewhere between wishful and nutty. Extra-ordinary claims require extra-ordinary proof. 2) claiming that it's _d…

1. I am not saying that these UAP are definitely aliens. I am saying that the findings of the report make aliens a more likely explanation. The report found that physical objects exhibited behavior that suggests advanced technology - including flying at considerable speed without discernible means of propulsion.

It's unfair to characterize this line of thinking as "We don't know what we saw, so aliens." Instead, what I wrote was more like "The report does not contradict aliens. The findings of the report are consistent with what we might expect from alien technology. I am updating my beliefs to increase the likelihood that these UAP are explained by aliens."

Your line about extra-ordinary claims is a bit misguided. For one thing, multiple observations by multiple witnesses and multiple sensor modalities in multiple instances across decades is pretty good evidence. I don't know what evidence you would expect to see if alien technology was operating in our atmosphere, but the described observations seem consistent with that conclusion.

2. The DNI report says "a Handful of UAP Appear to Demonstrate Advanced Technology" and "Some UAP appeared to ... move at considerable speed, without discernable means of propulsion" and "Most of the UAP reported probably do represent physical objects given that a majority of UAP were registered across multiple sensors, to include radar, infrared, electro-optical, weapon seekers, and visual observation." That doesn't sound like "bug-on-the-lens" type observations to me.

Obviously I can't know how good the DNI evidence is. They haven't shared much of it. I don't think it's reasonable to conclude from the report that people are getting confused with lens flares or equipment failures though.

3. That doesn't seem like an argument at all. Any thing which we have observed for a while but haven't explained would fit this description of being "perpetually liminal". UFOs fit the description worse than most things because they aren't very "perpetual". UFO sightings go back ~70 years. That's hardly perpetual. It's also not the case that we always know roughly the same amount. This report for example uses evidence to advance our understanding, arguing that they are physical objects, that they may emit RF energy, and that they have capabilities we do not.

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#37

The most obvious explanation is that the American defense department is probing Chinese and Russian military with advanced drone technology and they would like the Chinese and Russians to think that the American military is also being probed and are equally baffled by it. PsyOps in other words. I doubt they are buying it. I assume that when the Chinese or Russians encounter any unexplained tech it is assumed to be th…

I think it is way simpler than that. They want money for a new thing that will cost a lot and yield no results requiring more money. Hunting UFOs is an endless money pit.

Since when did the defense department need elaborate pretexts for their endless money pits?

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is way simpler than that. They want money for a new thing that will cost a lot and yield no results requiring more money. Hunting UFOs is an endless money pit.

Since when did the defense department need elaborate pretexts for their endless money pits?

See Iraq, as just one example. Remember Colin Powell’s charade at the UN?

Re: U.S. unable to explain more than 140 unidentified flying objects, but no aliens

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is way simpler than that. They want money for a new thing that will cost a lot and yield no results requiring more money. Hunting UFOs is an endless money pit.

Since when did the defense department need elaborate pretexts for their endless money pits?

Since they had to start competing with an ever growing demand by population for increasing social serivces like Unversal Healthcare, and UBI, combined with current social services and debt taking up over 50% of the federal budget.

They see the writting on the wall, America can no longer fund its war machine unless there is an enemy, Russia / Cold War is played out even though they are still trying to beat that dead horse, China is not viewed as threat by most citizens as we get all of our cheap shit from them...

Nope Aliens makes a perfect scare for the masses to accept increases in taxation and debt

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