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Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

economist.com

11–20 of 109 posts

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#11
My kid is They figured out PPE and distancing protocols about six weeks after initial shutdown and all kids were back in class. To our knowledge, there were no known covid outbreaks (all parents and staff are emailed when a staff or student is diagnosed).

Capitalism wins again.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#12
post #8
post #2

> But few governments have weighed the costs and risks carefully. I'm not entirely comfortable with the narrative that the costs and risks weren't weighed carefully. It wasn't that the pros and cons weren't weighed. Every human decision involves the weighing of pros and cons. For every decision that harms someone, a person decided that the harms were justified because of some other goal they deemed necessary. The sol…

It's not clear to me that this was a poor decision. You can't send children to school if there are no teachers. And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Teachers are well aware that whatever is going around among the students will get to them. They get every cold and ever flu. If school boards said, "We're staying open for the sake of the children", teachers would have said, "Fin…

> And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs.

Many of them were at greater risk of death from driving to school than they were from Covid.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#13
post #2

> But few governments have weighed the costs and risks carefully. I'm not entirely comfortable with the narrative that the costs and risks weren't weighed carefully. It wasn't that the pros and cons weren't weighed. Every human decision involves the weighing of pros and cons. For every decision that harms someone, a person decided that the harms were justified because of some other goal they deemed necessary. The sol…

Fauci admitted in the first month of the lockdown that he only considered medical concerns, not educational or economic.

So:

1) He was the wrong guy to be setting policy during corona.

2) This was known a year before his emails were released, which point to an international conspiracy of virologists attempting to maintain corona, and likely GoF, funding.

Without billions in govt. funding, their labs (and careers) disappear.

The various virologists worked a circuit between US, Canada, Australia and China. All 4 countries are involved in a coverup that various journalists have exposed.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#14
post #2

> But few governments have weighed the costs and risks carefully. I'm not entirely comfortable with the narrative that the costs and risks weren't weighed carefully. It wasn't that the pros and cons weren't weighed. Every human decision involves the weighing of pros and cons. For every decision that harms someone, a person decided that the harms were justified because of some other goal they deemed necessary. The sol…

A loud minority of twitter mob participants shouted "You want to kill grandma!" every time anyone tried to discuss the full costs of the lockdowns. People don't want to risk their careers saying things that are unpopular with twitter mobs (especially in academia). So now we're effectively governed by emotional neurotics and government can no longer make reasonable decisions based on a dispassionate cost-benefit analysis.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#15
post #4

This is crazy. No. Lack of school doesn’t create harm. Attempting to shoehorn traditional schooling into an online form certainly can.

So much of school is socialization with other human beings. Beyond academics, children need to experience being in a group and learning about how people are supposed to interact with each other. And most of this is not explicitly taught, but acquired through trial and error and simple monkey-see, monkey-do. You can't get that level of interaction and fidelity online.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#16
post #8
post #2

> But few governments have weighed the costs and risks carefully. I'm not entirely comfortable with the narrative that the costs and risks weren't weighed carefully. It wasn't that the pros and cons weren't weighed. Every human decision involves the weighing of pros and cons. For every decision that harms someone, a person decided that the harms were justified because of some other goal they deemed necessary. The sol…

It's not clear to me that this was a poor decision. You can't send children to school if there are no teachers. And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Teachers are well aware that whatever is going around among the students will get to them. They get every cold and ever flu. If school boards said, "We're staying open for the sake of the children", teachers would have said, "Fin…

As someone who is literally studying to be a teacher, I don't think teachers were being entirely reasonable throughout the pandemic. Particularly a little later on when we didn't have vaccines yet, but knew more about how the virus spread and were somewhat better at treating it.

Yes, teachers didn't sign up for this. Neither did grocery store workers or—in many cases—even nurses and other hospital staff. Everyone did what they had to to stop the world from collapsing.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#17
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not clear to me that this was a poor decision. You can't send children to school if there are no teachers. And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Teachers are well aware that whatever is going around among the students will get to them. They get every cold and ever flu. If school boards said, "We're staying open for the sake of the children", teachers would have said, "Fin…

> And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Many of them were at greater risk of death from driving to school than they were from Covid.

Does this pass for an argument now? Plenty of teachers are also severely at risk, and there is good reason to think that many would have died painful, preventable deaths had they taught in person.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#18
post #5

I live in a city with 95% adult vaccination (at least one dose) and the government has just announced that they are exploring how to open schools at an indeterminate date in the future. If we can’t just go back to normal now, then why don’t we just give up?

Adults don't go to school. It's not that much further to vaccinate kids though, we are almost there. In the UK schools have been open, and the new variant is rampaging through, if we hit vaccine escape it will be because of actions like this.

Once all the kids are vaccinated (and BTW even the WHO is taking a cautious approach on this given that it's unclear whether young children are at more risk from Covid or the shots), what's the plan for preventing variants from developing in the developed world? In animal reservoirs? In the large numbers of vaccinated people who still wind up hosting (usually minor and asymptomatic) infections?

If vaccine escape happens because the UK had its schools open then I find it very difficult to believe "we vaccinate everyone at once and the virus just goes away" was ever a realistic prospect in the first place.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#19
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not clear to me that this was a poor decision. You can't send children to school if there are no teachers. And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Teachers are well aware that whatever is going around among the students will get to them. They get every cold and ever flu. If school boards said, "We're staying open for the sake of the children", teachers would have said, "Fin…

> And the teachers were not going to put their lives on the line for those jobs. Many of them were at greater risk of death from driving to school than they were from Covid.

You were downvoted because of how the current generation of adults judges your comment; but how will the next generation see things?

I haven't heard any discussion about this question, at all, and frankly, it disturbs me, today's children are tomorrow's adults.

Somehow, I don't think, "think of the teachers," or "we didn't think it through" will be good enough for them.

Re: Closing the world's schools caused children great harm

#20
post #4

This is crazy. No. Lack of school doesn’t create harm. Attempting to shoehorn traditional schooling into an online form certainly can.

So much of school is socialization with other human beings. Beyond academics, children need to experience being in a group and learning about how people are supposed to interact with each other. And most of this is not explicitly taught, but acquired through trial and error and simple monkey-see, monkey-do. You can't get that level of interaction and fidelity online.

Sure. But then you end up with adults who are incapable of socialization outside of school. Maybe having children develop making friends outside of school is a good idea.
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