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“Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

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31–40 of 277 posts

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#31
Hi Leizhen, and guys in the mail list,

Recently I find one patch removing a debug OOM error message from btrfs selftest.

It's nothing special, some small cleanup work from some kernel newbie.

But the mail address makes me cautious, "@huawei.com".

The last time we got some similar patches from the same company, doing something harmless "cleanup". But those "fixes" are also useless.

This makes me wonder, what is really going on here.

After some quick search, more and more oom error message "cleanup" patches just show up, even some misspell fixes.

It's OK for first-time/student developers to submit such patches, and I really hope such patches would make them become a long term contributor.

In fact, I started my kernel contribution exactly by doing such "cleanups".

But what you guys are doing is really KPI grabbing, I have already see several maintainers arguing with you on such "cleanups", and you're always defending yourself to try to get those patches merged.

You're sending the patch representing your company, by doing this you're really just damaging the already broken reputation.

Please stop this KPI grabbing behavior, and do real contribution to fix the damaged reputation.

^^ Original message

Not sure where he said it'd be okay if anyone else sent it - but I can see why a string of "cleanup" from a company can be seen as more as metric manipulation than any actual worthwhile contribution.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#32
Since there are talks about padding numbers for KPI, I did a quick analysis of the linux kernel for single line changes that belong to commits with only one file change and this is what I got for the last 90 days:

https://public-001.gitsense.com/insights/github/repos?q=comm...

Scroll down to the bottom for a breakdown of the file types.

To review the file changes (click on the files) and commits, look at the following:

https://public-001.gitsense.com/insights/github/repos?p=comm...

Disclaimer: I'm the creator of GitSense and there is a bug where the window size won't show 90, but it is for 90 days.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#33
The tone of the email reminds me a lot of Linus Torvald’s brutal code review comments in the google group back then.

Can it be said that the “no nonsense” behavior often exhibited by maintainers of Linux kernel could be one of the reason the project grew to become what it is today

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#34
post #3

What does "KPI" mean in this context? Never heard the term before

"Key Performance Indicator". I believe the implication here is that some people from Huawei are sending useless patches just to pad their performance values and look better inside the company.

Indeed... although I'd point the blame more squarely at management deciding that "number of patches" is the right way to measure someone's performance.

Not that I have any idea if that's the case here, but I've worked in places like that. Idiotic approach.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#36
Open Source is such a surprisingly high trust ecosystem. I really hope that isn't something that has to be changed in the future.

I can 100% understand the concern here.

Possibly there is some sort of internal corporate metric or just personal bragging rights get tied to these kinds of patches. It costs the company nothing to incentivize this and the maintainers get all the work associated with it.

Like all metrics "When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure." (Goodhart's law). There's really no reason for huawei to change other than for the maintainers to ask them to not do that thing.

I recall a talk from a maintainer once gave at some company (I forget where). He detailed what kind of patches get accepted and what don't. They were pretty straight forward standards, some more obvious than others (you know ... say what the patch does accurately).

It wasn't stated but he clearly expected some level of professionalism or just efficiency from the folks giving him work to look through their code on behalf of their company.

I don't think that's too much to expect.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#37
post #3

What does "KPI" mean in this context? Never heard the term before

Key Performance Indicator: ie, someone at huawei’s job performance review depends on “made N open source contributions to major projects”, and Goodhart’s Law strikes again.

Came to the comments to learn what KPI was. And leaned about Goodharts law: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goodhart%27s_law

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#38
I have worked in team with some kernel developers at Samsung, years ago, so let me put some perspective for those who do not understand the dynamics.

In some companies, the amount of patents or Linux kernel patches you get accepted is direct measure of your success.

As you know, whatever you measure becomes a target -- these guys feel very pressed to get ANY kernel commits accepted, no matter how small, irrelevant or nonsensical. Because in the very end almost nobody sees the amount of value that a company creates for Linux users. What everybody is looking at is that "Company X is nth on the list of biggest kernel contributors".

So "KPI grabbing" is meant to mean the practice of not caring for the value or quality of your contributions but rather for the count of the commits or LoC you can get accepted.

This is damaging to Linux kernel developer community because it just creates work for maintainers without creating much or any value at all.

These maintainers are absolutely critical resource for the project and their number and availability translates directly to how much stuff can actually be done. So no wonder people are irked by it.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#39

I see that these "cleanup" patches are not bringing much value, bust I also don't see why fixing spelling mistakes or log messages is considered as harmful, KPI boosting or not. The maintainer even said if someone else sent those patches it would be OK, but not if Huawei employees do it. If they distrust Huawei so much, why not just ban them from committing, the same way they did recently with university "security re…

It's likely the context of available time and resources that matters here. Huawei has the ability to contribute a lot, but instead sends an experienced, highly paid person around to hammer in a nail that was sticking out slightly and calls you over (when you could be doing something more productive) to high five a job well done. This would be appropriate for an beginner apprentice.

Yeah, it might've been slightly annoying to someone, but it's a visible waste of time overall.

Re: “Please don't waste maintainers' time on your KPI grabbing patches”

#40
post #18
post #12

Without any context it looks like someone overreacted. It's essentially saying anybody else than Huawei sending cleanup patches is welcome but Huawei is not. Then they try to backtrack that statement by putting out a long list of things which aren't comparable in complexity to the original topic. Without more context I bet this thread is going to go off-topic.

The remark close to the end, that this is just further damages Huawei's already damaged reputation, especially after beginning with "I did the same at some point", hints at a personal issue rather than professional objection. There's no professional reason to take such an unrelated jab so it feels more like this individual just found an opportunity to settle a score, or has a different problem with Huawei that's hard…

Yep. This is incredibly petty and unprofessional from the reviewer. Keep the ridiculous geopolitical slapfights out of the Linux kernel.
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