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John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

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Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#931

Post by hda111 »

nkmnz wrote: post #849
fastball wrote: post #791

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you holding that up as an example of a functional justice system? Because that strikes me as more dysfunctional , where people are getting preferential treatment because they're part of the German footie machine.

The example is just the one that’s most well known in Germany, but almost 4 years for tax evasion is in fact a high sentence and far from preferential treatment, taking into account that Hoeneß turned himself in voluntarily which was, due to mistakes of his lawyers, not accounted for in court. Better tax lawyers could have probably prevented jail time all together in such a scenario. „Open jail“ is the usual way to g…

But why do you chose this example? It’s not realistic at all. Maybe if John was German and also involved in German football. But as German business man he would have sentenced to 10 years.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#932

Post by ceejayoz »

jpttsn wrote: post #855
ceejayoz wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He said he'd eat his dick on live TV if Bitcoin didn't hit $500k by last year ( https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/887012614131372032 , https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/887039604846714881 , https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/887024683379544065 ) so the track record on predictions... isn't great.

Maybe he was joking?

I certainly see no reason to take what he says at face value, but this includes the "I've been suicided!" tweets.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#933

Post by keymone »

henvic wrote: post #929
keymone wrote: post #911

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You only think this because you were brainwashed by statism ever since you were a kid. This can be flipped back to you without much effort: You only think this because you were brainwashed by your preferred flavor of anarchism ever since you started reading those propaganda web sites on the internet. Making such a claim doesn't bring any value to the conversation and only serves to estrange you from this community,…

> You only think this because you were brainwashed by your preferred flavor of anarchism ever since you started reading those propaganda web sites on the internet. No, you're lying. The state is an artificial construction, and I'm advocating the lack of thereof. I'm not promoting the construction of an institution that is supported by enslaving men and women. If you're, finding a way to defend this sick vision of the…

> No, you're lying. The state is an artificial construction, and I'm advocating the lack of thereof. I'm not promoting the construction of an institution that is supported by enslaving men and women. If you're, finding a way to defend this sick vision of the world is on you.

You only think this because you were brainwashed by your preferred flavor of anarchism ever since you started reading those propaganda web sites on the internet.

See how easy it is to debate using your style?

On a serious note - government and state are self-emergent phenomenons in any society. The problem you really have is how much control that society has over it’s governance and how much accountability people in government have.

But instead of discussing actually interesting things you choose to regurgitate slogans and propaganda from anarchist websites, firmly entrenching yourself into confirmation, sunk cost and other biases, without actually trying to understand the subject.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#934

Post by 542354234235 »

fastball wrote: post #790
anigbrowl wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably (by which I refer to the standard of judgement in the civil suit). https://www.theregister.com/2019/03/20/mcafee_25m_lawsuit_ne...

That was a default judgement, which means he automatically lost because he didn't show up to court, not on the merit of the suit.

No it doesn’t mean that. He didn’t automatically lose because he didn’t show up. The court, specifically the United States Court of Appeals for the Eleventh Circuit, allowed the Faull estate to petition for a default judgement due to McAfee’s continued failure to respond and due to the merits of the case presented. They did not, and would not, allow a default judgment on a meritless case.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#935

Post by 542354234235 »

dragonwriter wrote: post #689
FireBeyond wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would just add some skepticism to the charges only because the police down there can be corrupt and or inept and subject to bribery and so on. I don't know if there has been an independent international inquiry into the matter. A US federal judge found him culpable for a murder civilly.

> A US federal judge found him culpable for a murder civilly False. A US federal judge entered a default judgement against him in a wrongful death suit. Murder is not a civil offense, the standards for civil wrongful death are not remotely the same as murder, and wrongful death liability (even based on a trial and evidence) doesn't indicate that one has even approximately committed murder. And, in any case the judgem…

> wrongful death liability (even based on a trial and evidence) doesn't indicate that one has even approximately committed murder

This is true in general, but not true specifically for this case. A wrongful death case does not need to indicate murder, as wrongful deaths can occur for many reasons. But in this case, the award of the $20 million in punitive damages (damages to punish the defendant, not to compensate the victim) specifically were for the torture and murder, with intentional malice, of Faull.

>the judgement was a default judgement because McAfee didn't answer the lawsuit, not a judgement based on evidence.

No it wasn’t. He didn’t automatically lose because he didn’t show up. The court, specifically the United States Court of Appeals for the Eleventh Circuit, allowed the Faull estate to petition for a default judgement due to McAfee’s continued failure to respond and due to the merits of the case presented. They did not, and would not, allow a default judgment on a meritless case.

Pdf of the actual Decision. https://regmedia.co.uk/2019/03/20/mcafee-belize.pdf

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#936

Post by csense »

6t6t6t6 wrote: post #819
kenneth wrote: post #765

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't take the claims of suicide at face value when McAfee has literally stated that if he dies of suicide it's probably a setup. https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/131680121508322509... https://twitter.com/officialmcafee/status/120086428376625152...

He died in a Catalan prison, not in US. Even if the US government had really any reason to kill him, sending an agent to prison in a foreign country to fake a suicide, when he was going to get extradited anyway, seems a bit hard to believe. The other explanation -that the policemen in the Catalan prison were useless enough to let him hang himself without them realizing- seems more plausible.

> sending an agent to prison in a foreign country to fake a suicide

In the US, police culture generally doesn't allow taking bribes or letting sketchy figures with improper documentation into prison cells to administer extra-legal punishment.

In the other countries, things might be a lot more relaxed -- I don't know about the police in this particular country, but I imagine there are a fair number of prisons around the world where the guards might let an assassin in and out, no questions asked, as long as the bribe is big enough, or even themselves have a little side hustle, providing the service of murdering prisoners who've made well-funded enemies.

Also, presumably most US government assassins are part of the CIA, and aren't supposed to operate inside the US.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#937

Post by croutonwagon »

stjohnswarts wrote: post #695
duxup wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's unfortunate that a lot of things we like about people, doesn't really go hand in hand for making good choices otherwise.

Yes I've met a number of personable people who I completely disagreed with on politics and their actions, as long as you don't challenge their ideological stances. It's kind of like dealing with an alcoholic as long as you don't challenge their addiction everything tends to go well. It happened to me just last night on the phone. The human mind is a complex thing.

I have found many people (though not most) can be fine and pleasant even when you directly challenge their ideologies. But that is only assuming you do so in a respectful manner. In fact most of my best friends have different stances and we often regularly challenge them in discussion.

What I have noticed in recent years is that people increasingly have little respect for those they disagree with and it’s largely on the basis of that disagreement.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#938

Post by fastball »

542354234235 wrote: post #934
fastball wrote: post #790

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was a default judgement, which means he automatically lost because he didn't show up to court, not on the merit of the suit.

No it doesn’t mean that. He didn’t automatically lose because he didn’t show up. The court, specifically the United States Court of Appeals for the Eleventh Circuit, allowed the Faull estate to petition for a default judgement due to McAfee’s continued failure to respond and due to the merits of the case presented. They did not, and would not, allow a default judgment on a meritless case.

Meritless cases don't even make it that far (the court refuses to hear the case), so while true this seems like an unnecessary quibble. Yes, the suit had enough to actually be heard by a court, but the reason for the judgement is due to McAfee's refusal to even participate. Said another way: if McAfee had participated, this is not the judgement that would've been reached. McAfee may have still be found responsible by the court, but not for the same reason.

It is certainly not the normal level of proof people take a court decision as being.

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#939

Post by nkmnz »

hda111 wrote: post #930
nkmnz wrote: post #568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, we don’t add up prison time in Germany for repeating the same or related crimes over and over. On top, the 10/15 years are the maximum and barely reached. E.g. Uli Hoeneß, ex-manager of the soccer club Bayern Munich, got 3.5 years for evasion of ~30m dollar in a total of 7 counts, but could actually leave prison after sth like two years, 1.5 of which where „open jail time“, so he could go to work and only had t…

> Uli Hoeneß That would be an example for someone punished lightly. If you and I did this it would be near maximum possible. Some people are more equal.

This is simply not true.

You and me would be smart enough to hire lawyers that can file a proper „Selbstanzeige“ according to §371 Abgabenordnung, which would prevent us from going to jail altogether ;-)

Re: John McAfee found dead in Spanish jail after court approves extradition to US

#940

Post by nkmnz »

javagram wrote: post #600
nkmnz wrote: post #568

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, we don’t add up prison time in Germany for repeating the same or related crimes over and over. On top, the 10/15 years are the maximum and barely reached. E.g. Uli Hoeneß, ex-manager of the soccer club Bayern Munich, got 3.5 years for evasion of ~30m dollar in a total of 7 counts, but could actually leave prison after sth like two years, 1.5 of which where „open jail time“, so he could go to work and only had t…

> Nope, we don’t add up prison time in Germany for repeating the same or related crimes over and over. On top, the 10/15 years are the maximum and barely reached. The USA is similar, sentences are often served concurrently meaning the headline numbers don’t get added up. Headlines reflect the absolute maximum penalties but there’s something called the Sentencing Guidelines that is used to set the actual length of the…

Interestingly, I’ve just listened to Kahneman’s “Noise”, which features a whole chapter about Sentencing Guidelines in the US! Very good book!
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