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Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

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Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#161

Post by hluska »

throwawayboise wrote: post #98
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How the hell is "Oof, we're so sorry about this." remotely similar to "uwu we'we sowwy dis isn't wewking anymowe.. pwease don't be angwy wiff us" I get it, some forms of communication aren't your bag. But I think it's at least reasonable to focus on a company's intent even if the verbiage isn't what you'd prefer. FWIW I'm quite older than a millennial, but I didn't find anything infantilizing about Notion's response…

The word "oof" affects a casual, breezy tone that is inappropriate in a professional response to a customer concern.

Or it’s a genuine expression of embarrassment and anyone who would be bothered by that is an asshole. It’s three letters. Who cares?

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#162

Post by hluska »

naikrovek wrote: post #94
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How the hell is "Oof, we're so sorry about this." remotely similar to "uwu we'we sowwy dis isn't wewking anymowe.. pwease don't be angwy wiff us" I get it, some forms of communication aren't your bag. But I think it's at least reasonable to focus on a company's intent even if the verbiage isn't what you'd prefer. FWIW I'm quite older than a millennial, but I didn't find anything infantilizing about Notion's response…

it's insulting because it is attempting to minimize the customer's stake in the problem by appearing to be concerned and empathetic. if they were concerned or empathetic, the issue would not have lasted as long as it has. in short, it's disingenuous and it's an attempt to minimize the customer's concerns.

Do you have special crystal ball that lets you peer into another company’s dev processes? If not, who are you to claim people have no empathy? That’s not only a really dark view of humans but it ignores the possibility that they cannot fix it right now.

God people, have a touch of respect for our colleagues.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#163

Post by hluska »

gostsamo wrote: post #127
pm90 wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. To me, its a strong signal that the person on the other end is not an offshored, overworked drone but someone who is treated well by the company and cares enough to express empathy.

Don't try to be funny in your docs. If you want to convey information, make it clean, precise, and to the point. Do not assume and do not distract. Please. P.S. Jokes are not totally forbidden, but they should be more subtle and not so intrusive as "You are asking me a question, but here I'll give you a performance instead of an answer".

Yes, the word ‘oof’ denotes a performance. The etymology dates back to early vaudeville days when Barker Malarkey used it to start the Famous Malarkey Family’s drag show…

Except that’s not true. That whole paragraph is a load of malarkey.

It’s a word. You don’t know the person involved and you’re making more awful assumptions based upon three letters.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#164

Post by hluska »

realitysballs wrote: post #146
freedomben wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, I've written stuff very much like that before for customers that were hitting bugs. I wasn't trying to be "aw shucks" funny. I legitimately feel sorry that my shitty software was breaking on them. That they provided a workaround seemed like a nice thing to me. In fact that whole message seemed pretty good to me. It's probably not entirely that employee's fault but they're still trying to empathize and he…

As a millennial myself I appreciate this type of lingo. I think it’s a generational or cultural shift if some sort

I’m in my mid-forties. The tech industry wasn’t at all like this when I was young. Somewhere along the lines, people stopped being nice and having a personality apparently became a personality flaw.

I’m taking a break from this fucking site. I can’t believe the extent to which my colleagues are roasting someone over three letters. Bunch of fucking bullies if you ask me.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#166

Post by LAC-Tech »

DangitBobby wrote: post #106
LAC-Tech wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I'm a millenial and I can't stand it either. Doggo, pupper, adulting, ninja/rockstar/awesome, oof, yikes, "my dude"... and don't even get me started about dressing like you're still in high school (pro-tip - unless you're are in great shape no one wants to see you in a tight fitting t-shirt). Big reason why I'm now a "programmer in the X industry" as opposed to an "X programmer". I guess I just wasn't a "cultura…

> pro-tip - unless you're are in great shape no one wants to see you in a tight fitting t-shirt There's a decent chance that these people don't seek your approval. Also, how has "pro-tip" not made your list?

Personal appearance and hygiene isn't something insecure people do to seek approval.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#167

Post by pmontra »

josephg wrote: post #142
pmontra wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the case of GitHub and any other similar service the lockin is the number of services they added to the plain repository. Pull requests, issues, wiki, API for third party services, etc. You get back some of them if you self host with GitLab but every service supports GitHub, maybe not GitLab. In this case, I don't even know what they get when they export from Notion but how are they going to collaborate on those d…

Yeah, I wish PRs, issues, wiki and all that was also stored in the git repository. I understand there's no incentive for github to do so, but it would make interoperability so much easier. > how are they going to collaborate on those data? CRDTs make collaboration possible and work well, without needing a central source of truth. For example, Yjs.

The wiki is a git repository of markdown files (maybe some other format too.) I edit locally, commit and push to GitHub. The name of the repository is user/project.wiki The file for the sidebar is _Sidebar.md

No idea if other services can import those files into their wikis.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#168

Post by justsomeuser »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #6

I'm not a Notion customer, but frankly with a response like this I would never, ever be one. It's one thing to make a new feature request and have the response be "sorry, we'll get to it when we get to it." It's quite another to have a bug in an advertised, previously working feature, with no workaround, and say "sorry, our engineers have a big backlog." Imagine if a bank said "sorry, we know the withdrawal feature t…

Digital Ocean does this for VM downloads - you cannot export your VM as an image.

So if you create a snowflake VM there is now way you can move it off Digital Ocean.

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#169

Post by abdusco »

sebmellen wrote: post #59
boplicity wrote: post #40

Here's what Notion.so says about this on their website. https://www.notion.so/Back-up-your-data-1a8eb5bdfce34d19a636... - *I tried clicking the `Export all workspace content` button but received an error message.* Oof, so sorry about this For particularly large workspaces, the `Export all workspace content` function may have some trouble completing the export. We're investigating this issue and hope to have a resolut…

God, if there’s one thing I hate it’s that condescending millennial speak to cover up a serious issue. > Oof, so sorry about this... What??? If your company is broken don’t make it seem like a funny “aw shucks” blunder.

Reminds me of this tweet recently posted here :)

https://twitter.com/cherrikissu/status/972524442600558594

Re: Ask HN: Notion is withholding my company data, what can I do?

#170

Post by jmstfv »

This is something that has been worrying me for quite some time. Considering how many folks use Notion as a knowledge base for their personal and professional lives, I'm sure others feel the same.

Since their API is in public beta, I'm building a tool to back up and restore your Notion data to a storage provider of your choice:

https://notionbackups.com

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