A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities • Hacker News Board

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#31

Post by terfisaslur » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:43 PM UTC

jdross wrote: post #19

SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #7

I don’t know if this article is describing this phenomenon accurately, as the first paragraph contains an obvious falsehood: “ A flyer with an image of a gun and text reading “shut the fuck up, terf” (trans-exclusionary radical feminist, a slur) was circulating. ”. TERF isn’t a slur. No one has successfully beaten and killed a woman while calling her a TERF and then got away with it in court like the gay panic defens…

A slur is an allegation that is likely to insult them or damage their reputation. That's clearly why terf was used in this context. I've noticed leftist communities frequently attempting to redefine incendiary words (such as 'racism') as a political tactic, to a lot of success.

The onslaught of neologisms and redefinitions come directly from the academic Critical Social Justice fields

These are federally subsidized academic fields

So if you want to see the Left stop redefining words, the public needs to stop funding their careers in academia

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#32

Post by ixacto » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:45 PM UTC

tetranomiga wrote: post #14

Gender politics is a cancer on the left, even though I agree with it, it takes up so much time and energy away from things that would benefit everybody including trans people, like universal healthcare, better employee protection laws and better, more available education. Such a small percentage of the population has been the center point of so much discussion and debate, and for what benefit? All I see it doing is g…

Yeah I’m not on the left any more and now an independent due to the left trying to use identity politics for political engagement. Still support what Bernie/Yang are doing though with trying to universalize healthcare and income though.

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#33

Post by terfisaslur » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:45 PM UTC

SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #22

sorenjan wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1a : an insulting or disparaging remark or innuendo b : a shaming or degrading effect https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/slur

It’s not shaming to say someone is against trans people nor is it disparaging unless someone is bringing politics and moralism into it. Like I said I don’t want even more gender politics from the other “side” as some kind of “backlash” journalistic piece. It’s all a wash of nonsense.

No one in the mainstream is "against trans people," what they're against is denying biological realities like sexual dimorphism in pursuit of a fashion trend.

I don't care if you're a man and you want to go by she/her, that's totally fine, but you're still not going to be placed in a cell with a female in prison if you've raped someone and happen to be trans identifying, sorry.

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#34

Post by terfisaslur » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:47 PM UTC

fwn wrote: post #10

SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #7

I don’t know if this article is describing this phenomenon accurately, as the first paragraph contains an obvious falsehood: “ A flyer with an image of a gun and text reading “shut the fuck up, terf” (trans-exclusionary radical feminist, a slur) was circulating. ”. TERF isn’t a slur. No one has successfully beaten and killed a woman while calling her a TERF and then got away with it in court like the gay panic defens…

Wikipedia writes about that thought in their two opening paragraphs and concludes: > In academic discourse, there is no consensus on whether or not TERF constitutes a slur. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TERF Sure, if someone uses it in their paper on, for example, history of feminist thought I wouldn't assume it to be offensive. On the other hand I don't think that the intention behind a sentence like “shut the fuck…

Oh yeah Wikipedia has NEVER shown ANY bias on political topics

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#35

Post by tetranomiga » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:47 PM UTC

mabub24 wrote: post #20

One thing I find quite odd is how the study of gender emerged out of an approach that demanded a critical understanding of assumptions and the things society insist upon (that there are only 2 genders, that gender is essentially related to biological sex rather than something that is manifest in social behaviour, ect.) and yet that view has twisted into a sort of all or nothing view that is extremely antagonistic to…

I dunno if I'd agree that it's a small vocal minority, zero-tolerance to anybody questioning the current dogma is seen everywhere where trans acceptance is a focus. Ten years ago I was told, by trans people, that there are physical differences between trans and cis brains. Say that today, and you get kicked out of LGBT spaces for being a transmedicalist or truscum.

I have no idea whether it's true or not because you can't even find research on the subject because of how absurdly politicized the topic is.

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#36

Post by throwaway284534 » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:48 PM UTC

There’s a lot that’s already been said in this topic but I feel compelled to bring up the damage imposed by TERF talking points. The conversation goes something like this: “Transgender women possess an innate maleness that carries a non-zero threat to female spaces.” They believe that dictionary definitions of woman are prescriptive, declared at the chromosomes during birth, rather than descriptive, as in how one presents in both dress and phenotype.

In my experience this is the center of every “debate.” It’s less about the merits of the cause and more about convincing this point against the hypothetical risk of a male who’s taken advantage of self identified gender. TERFs are generally not interested in dynamics of trans men, who seem to be more like “gender traitors” than their deceptive counterparts.

Personally I find this whole movement a farce. Every talking point not only misaligns with trans women, it causes more harm to cis women at scale. “Real women” give birth — except hundreds of thousands who cannot. “Real women” look like the contemporary feminine ideal, yet 1 in 10 women suffer from PCOS enduring testosterone levels higher than any trans woman has to contend with. And the cake topper of them all, “trans women fuel negative stereotypes of femininity,” while simultaneously not appearing feminine enough, often barred from HRT until after puberty. This Goldilocks zone of womanhood is always out of reach, and therefore transness is never acceptable.

- a trans woman

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#37

Post by JanneVee » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:50 PM UTC

lr4444lr wrote: post #6

A flyer with an image of a gun and text reading “shut the fuck up, terf” (trans-exclusionary radical feminist, a slur) was circulating Not accepting incivility from people is hardly what I'd call a "backlash". We don't operate our universities on the heckler's veto.

> We don't operate our universities on the heckler's veto.

I've seen a few videos from various Universities where invited speakers are shouted down because of supposed wrong views. But then it isn't the heckler's veto if their views are wrong or what?

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#38

Post by foolinaround » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:51 PM UTC

while this article focusses on the gender ideology issues, IMHO the censorship in universites is on a wider range of issues, with the common denominator being the viewpoints espoused in far-left circles (not passing judgement here on whether they are right or wrong)

Enforced group-think is going to be the death of these universities.

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#39

Post by zozbot234 » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:54 PM UTC

tetranomiga wrote: post #35

mabub24 wrote: post #20

One thing I find quite odd is how the study of gender emerged out of an approach that demanded a critical understanding of assumptions and the things society insist upon (that there are only 2 genders, that gender is essentially related to biological sex rather than something that is manifest in social behaviour, ect.) and yet that view has twisted into a sort of all or nothing view that is extremely antagonistic to…

I dunno if I'd agree that it's a small vocal minority, zero-tolerance to anybody questioning the current dogma is seen everywhere where trans acceptance is a focus. Ten years ago I was told, by trans people, that there are physical differences between trans and cis brains. Say that today, and you get kicked out of LGBT spaces for being a transmedicalist or truscum. I have no idea whether it's true or not because you…

"Truscum" being the word for someone who thinks that changing one's gender and sexual characteristics might not be the greatest idea ever unless you actually have, like, gender dysphoria. Never mind the many, many people who are now pursuing "detransition" after going one step too far. I mean, what could possibly go wrong?

Re: A backlash against gender ideology is starting in universities

#40

Post by tetranomiga » Wed, Jun 23, 2021, 1:56 PM UTC

ixacto wrote: post #27

Freedom of expression/free speech doesn’t mean freedom not to be offended or that you have to agree with the views. If we do not support even the most offensive speech then we risk a very slippery slope leading to censorship and 1984.

There's no historical reason to think that not supporting extreme speech will lead to fascism. There are historical reasons to think that curbing extremist speech protects democracy (see the Weimar Republic).