What is the argument in favor of allowing transgenders to compete in female sports? Does anyone actually defend this decision?
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Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
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Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's the problem that division into genders is supposed to address. Currently we have n = 2. Results favoring one of the two genders is addressed by having separate categories with separate results: women's records, men's records.
Rather than splitting by gender it should be split by sex, or birth sex, if you prefer.
Everyone's relative chromosome string should be determined, like XXY and that should be the category, devoid of any loaded words like "man" or "woman". If you're XY, you don't get to got against XX athletes, regardless of the identity of anyone involved.
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I can't agree; the number of kilograms is too simplistic a parameter. I'd be more inclined to agree to some more sophisticated division that takes body composition into account. But that is still too simplistic if it is applied the same way in every sport. In some sports, mass is disadvantageous. In some sports, lean mass is advantageous, fat mass isn't. In some, raw mass is advantageous.
Perhaps classes on ability necessary to the sport should be the only way to go?
But that is futile, because ability necessary to the sport is what produces the results, i.e. rankings. So that amounts to just (1) everyone competing together as if there were one category, then (2) being ranked from winner to loser, and (3) we then declare that each rank is its own ability class, so everyone is a winner in their ability class!
Bob is the winner of the #1 division, Amy is the winner of the #2 division, and so on.
All the tuples of athletes who tied get to be in one class; e.g. if three people crossed the 10,000 meter finish at 29:13, they are in that ability class together, tying for that class' first place. :)
:)
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#34What is the argument in favor of allowing transgenders to compete in female sports? Does anyone actually defend this decision?
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Please don't take HN threads into ideological flamewar hell. If you start calling names like "social signalling" and "progressive elites", you're somewhere between pouring fuel on the flames and starting new ones. Not cool—regardless of what your views are.
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#35These kind of issues are really interesting because sports are by nature unfair, but it's been decided to remove part of the unfairness but now some is brought back in with that.
That's purely because the Olympics got rid of the poetry, town planning and similar events
https://www.planetizen.com/node/87885/going-gold-when-town-p...
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#36I think sports categories should be chromosome strings. "XX division", "XY world record". "XXY 400 m finals", "XYY long jump trials", ... Gender identity doesn't factor into it at all; the words "man", "woman" should not be used. Problem solved; you don't get to wedge yourself into competition with XX persons if you're XY.
So the XX group on anabolic steroids won’t be an issue?
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
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Please don't take HN threads into ideological flamewar hell. If you start calling names like "social signalling" and "progressive elites", you're somewhere between pouring fuel on the flames and starting new ones. Not cool—regardless of what your views are. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
Sorry about that, I could have made that point more constructively and will edit my post accordingly.
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#38I think sports categories should be chromosome strings. "XX division", "XY world record". "XXY 400 m finals", "XYY long jump trials", ... Gender identity doesn't factor into it at all; the words "man", "woman" should not be used. Problem solved; you don't get to wedge yourself into competition with XX persons if you're XY.
It might be better to have hormone classes in sports the way boxing has weight classes. You could have Mike Tyson class all the way through Betty White class, and as a side benefit you'd be able to put women's sports teams in with appropriately matched men. As another side benefit a lot of people who were simply born with the wrong stuff to compete could rise to the top of their class by hard work. Since there's not that much value in "gene grading" people, when all the heroism comes from training and dedication, getting away from the birth lottery sports system could be helpful to the sports documentary industry, along with the human soul.
;)
Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#39Re: Rival weightlifter speaks out on transgender Hubbard's Olympic place
#40I think sports categories should be chromosome strings. "XX division", "XY world record". "XXY 400 m finals", "XYY long jump trials", ... Gender identity doesn't factor into it at all; the words "man", "woman" should not be used. Problem solved; you don't get to wedge yourself into competition with XX persons if you're XY.
Which percentage of those three letters categories are in the population? Very few. And competitive athletes in them? Probably epsilon. The man and woman categories worked without issue for centuries, the whole problem is self-inflected.