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Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

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Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#141
post #107

I work 7-hour days, but I might work 2 or 3 hours during that time. A lot of the time I find the work unbearable and can only bring myself to do it in short intervals. When the task is interesting, involves my skills, and I'm making progress, I can work for hours with almost no breaks. It really is an emotional thing. I won't force myself to do anything that is really painful because it ruins my mood for the whole da…

It is impossible to work 7 hours a day.

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#142

I was in a similar rut. Not just professionally but academically as well for most of my life. Motivation had to be forced to do more than just enough to blend into the crowd. It took me saying enough is enough in my 40's to go get tested. Turns out I have ADHD. Getting therapy to deal with anxiety and depression stuff as well as getting on Adderall has done wonders. I'm not suddenly working 40+ hours always in the zo…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#143
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm pretty sure it's true. I had to spend a ton of time explaining what I did and its values to my managers, like writing "ELI5" docs and then suddenly when they "got it" they paid very close attention to my work, and formed a team around me and established scope and got headcount. This is the messaging I got every single quarter: """David, your work is very good. All the people you work with say you're great and…

> you need to spend more time finding metrics that demonstrate that value and improving those I have always had trouble with this type of nebulous goal.

The challenge for me that I always struggled to explain to my leadership is that in many cases, the time investment to make an accurate metric dashboard greatly exceeds just fixing the problem and knowing anecdotally that it works (I worked with ML Whisperers, people whom I trusted a lot to understand the underlying problems and filter out noise).

For example, in my case (sending machines causing invisible data corruption to be replaced) I could have been promoted by doing the following:

1) Finding a metric that correlated with the user pain that I was fixing. In this case, it would be something like "number of jobs that die with a NaN in 1 hour" while running an A/B test (half the jobs in the fleet have some feature enabled) and showign that, with significance, our fix reduces the number of NaNs significantly. (data driven)

2) Demonstrate that the NaN rate corresponds to user productivity (this could be # of papers published, # of models trained per hour, whatever) and that high NaN rates really did have an effect (impact)

3) filter the data carefully, because the vast majority of nans are actually caused by user error, not silent data corruption (this was the actual hard part and nobody has a better solution than "run a determinstic calculation on 8 cores and use majority vote to find the baddie")

Run the above for 6 months, show it to all the execs in your division, get a few people from Search, Ads, YouTube or Research/DeepMind to say it increased revenue or decreased costs by 10%. Bingo: promotion, along wiht a full time job maintaining a dashboard with constant requests to add new features, fix code broken by other teams, and making even more presentations to execs on how dysfunctional it is.

Or, I could just focus on fixing the machines, hearing anecdotally from the ML Whisperers that it's working again, and go back to surfing hacker news and getting another 100 karma in a day.

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#144

If your employer is happy with you, there is no reason to 'feel guilty'. Being competent (top 20%) and working 3hrs / day is way more productive than a middle performer working 12 hrs / day. In my personal experience: I work with people that, in 5 minutes, I can accomplish more than they can in a day. And those people are not stupid / unmotivated. I also work with people that, in 5 minutes, can accomplish more than I…

> Being competent (top 20%) What sort of toxic exceptionalism led you to think that only 20% of workers are suitable for their jobs....

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Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#145
I spent ~6.5 years at Google working an hour a day at the most (cue Office Space, meeting with the Bobs) with nobody being the wiser. I met or exceeded all performance review expectations. When I left, my colleagues complimented me on my "work ethic". It wasn't just me doing that either. Most ppl are too busy focusing on whatever life goals and ladderisms they've assigned to themselves to really scrutinize what others are doing.

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#146
post #133
post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My dad explained it to me like this when I was a kid. I ignored it for a long time, but it definitely stuck in the back of my head. I asked him if we wanted to get a promotion or be a manager but he said he thought his role as a documents library was fine. "Do you know the Peter Principle? It's the idea that you get promoted when you do good work, but at some point, you'll be promoted to a level you're not competent…

Your dad was on to something.

he's retired now and works harder than ever before, leading trips for the sierra club and competing in crossword puzzle tournaments.

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#147
I have noticed that biggest inhibitor to my work is having to deal with other people's bullshit. If my manager doesn't really listen or isn't interested (or just fakes an interest) in making things well I kinda my lose motivation too to bring my best. Just being a monkey to churn-out half-assed code is what I hate the most and deteriorate my productivity too.

I can really pump out code with my own projects but doing the same to finish a bunch of nameless JIRA tickets isn't really the same. What do I get for providing some corporation more value? A pat on the shoulder? Hah.

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#148

If your employer is happy with you, there is no reason to 'feel guilty'. Being competent (top 20%) and working 3hrs / day is way more productive than a middle performer working 12 hrs / day. In my personal experience: I work with people that, in 5 minutes, I can accomplish more than they can in a day. And those people are not stupid / unmotivated. I also work with people that, in 5 minutes, can accomplish more than I…

> Being competent (top 20%) What sort of toxic exceptionalism led you to think that only 20% of workers are suitable for their jobs....

I think he’s referring to the 80/20 law, or Pareto distribution.

Essentially 80% of all corporate output is performed by 20% of the workforce, and continues down each chain (of the 20% doing 80% of the work, 20% of them are doing 80% and etc…)

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_distribution

https://www.americanexpress.com/en-us/business/trends-and-in...

Re: Ask HN: Feeling guilty for doing the bare minimum at work

#150
Read up a bit on ADHD. That 'hyperfocus' that occurs either with deadlines or on a passion project is a symptom, as is the inability to get excited about projects you simply don't want to do - especially given your otherwise positive reviews and your ability to clear your mind and hyperfocus near a deadline, it's something to consider.

I was diagnosed at 33, and it changed my life infinitely for the better. YMMV, and you may not have ADHD, but if you do, it is nothing to feel guilty about - it, in fact, gives you some insanely useful abilities that others simply don't have, as evidenced by the number of comments on this post explaining you have no guilt to feel, and your positive performance reviews.

But being able to understand why we do these things, and being able to understand how to adjust for them (whether through medication or coping mechanisms) is, alone, insanely relieving.

Consider picking up 'Driven to Distraction,' or 'Delivered From Distraction,' or check out these posts by Mark Suster which was what led me to get started on the path:

* https://bothsidesofthetable.com/how-to-know-if-you-have-add-...

* https://bothsidesofthetable.com/why-add-might-actually-benef...

* https://bothsidesofthetable.com/developing-an-action-plan-fo...

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