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We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

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Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#31

Post by dilippkumar »

lastofthemojito wrote: post #12

I think a lot of the responses to the straw man's questions are reasonable and thoughtful. But I think this sentiment: >I don't want to change the way I work, I just want people to join me in the office. My kids are driving me crazy. Is it weird to say I'm lonely; I miss my office friends. Deserves more respect. There are lot of types of people out there, and it seems like at least some of them are energized by being…

>I don't want to change the way I work

I understand.

> I just want people to join me in the office.

Not cool, don’t make me change my lifestyle.

> My kids are driving me crazy.

I understand.

> Is it weird to say I'm lonely;

I understand.

> I miss my office friends.

I understand.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#32

Post by ssully »

_6pvr wrote: post #23
ryandrake wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This one, I just don't get at all. If you have nothing to contribute to a meeting, and nothing to gain from listening, why are you joining the meeting to begin with? Just decline like a grown-up and get some actual work done. It doesn't do anyone any good to have you there on mute with the volume turned down, getting actual work done in the background. Nobody is going to notice you're gone, and if they do, who cares?…

> why are you joining the meeting to begin with? At companies that misuse meetings, most meetings are not optional to attend. Of course you could say "Well just don't go", but some people don't like getting fired over things like this. > Just decline like a grown-up and get some actual work done What a condescending way to communicate.

There is also the old adage that showing up is half the battle. Even if the company isn't in the habit of misusing meetings, showing up to meetings is important for establishing relationships with different people and departments. It sucks, but people are still social creatures, and meeting and talking to people face to face can have a strong lasting impression then a well written email.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#33

Post by WFHRenaissance »

system16 wrote: post #10

I have a ridiculous sounding but very important to me reason for my preference to work at home: bowel movements. I worked with a small team in a small office. Everybody is typically at their desk in silence with the occasional manager or sales person on the phone. At predictable intervals throughout the day, someone will get up and be gone extra long. You know, and everybody else knows, they've gone for a number 2. O…

This, and being able to shower whenever I want, and being able to put on presentable clothing for a Zoom call but then return to my sweatpants or even go topless... these sort of things are the reason I want to work from home. Maybe I'm crazy , or maladjusted, or maybe this is just the optimal way for me to work.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#34

Post by milkytron »

MattGaiser wrote: post #3

> I can't imagine another day of long Zoom meetings. The pandemic really reinforced to me that so many of these are pointless, at least for many participants. I have played games with co-workers, gone to sleep, done freelance work, had lunch (away from my desk), and all manner of other things through pretty much every meeting over 1 hour that I have had this pandemic. Especially the ceremonies like retro (exercise in…

> Especially the ceremonies like retro (exercise in taking notes and throwing them away)

Retro is one of those meetings that I have found very useful, at multiple companies. When done right, everyone should be involved, and useful action items will be taken away to make work easier in the future. I've seen retros done terribly wrong, where nothing is accomplished or taken away. Those seem like a waste, but I think when done right, it is actually a valuable use of time.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#35

Post by Pet_Ant »

andrewflnr wrote: post #25
donretag wrote: post #15

"You can choose your friends independently of your work" I have met the majority of my friends at work. Once you pass your 20s, your exposure to strangers diminishes greatly. And many of us do not have kids.

I think this is something that society can adjust to and be better off for it. People would have to be more intentional about meeting new people (seeking out meetups or whatever), but the results are likely to be better.

I find people just want to drink at home alone and watch Netflix. Good friends I had unworn for 20-odd years. WFH I imagine many will drink themselves to an early grave.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#36

Post by wayoutthere »

lastofthemojito wrote: post #12

I think a lot of the responses to the straw man's questions are reasonable and thoughtful. But I think this sentiment: >I don't want to change the way I work, I just want people to join me in the office. My kids are driving me crazy. Is it weird to say I'm lonely; I miss my office friends. Deserves more respect. There are lot of types of people out there, and it seems like at least some of them are energized by being…

So I think this expectation that work provide social connection only works for some people. I like the people I work with, but I have no need to spend time with them in person because I have other social outlets. If I have to participate in another social scene because someone I work with is lonely, that’s gas out of my tank to solve their problem. I don’t really have a lot in common with my coworkers except we work together.

Join a casual sports league or a club or something but don’t make me pretend to be your friend just to draw a paycheck. This is one aspect of work I have no interest in restarting.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#37

Post by orwin »

robbie-c wrote: post #6

I've tried a bunch of online whiteboard tools to design stuff (where stuff could be system architecture, UI, a business process, whatever), and nothing beats a whiteboard + post-its. Maybe I'm doing it wrong, it's possible, and I'd love to have some great counter-examples. Until then, I think that teams that can meet up in person will, on average, win over those who can't. Other days I just have long list of individu…

Two days at the office every two weeks is my new regimen, and it's the best of both world for me. I can afford to live pretty far of a big city, and a 3 hour train commute is just easy.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#38

Post by ajuc »

MattGaiser wrote: post #3

> I can't imagine another day of long Zoom meetings. The pandemic really reinforced to me that so many of these are pointless, at least for many participants. I have played games with co-workers, gone to sleep, done freelance work, had lunch (away from my desk), and all manner of other things through pretty much every meeting over 1 hour that I have had this pandemic. Especially the ceremonies like retro (exercise in…

I started to draw in ms paint during meetings and got pretty good in it last year :)

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#39

Post by dudul »

donretag wrote: post #15

"You can choose your friends independently of your work" I have met the majority of my friends at work. Once you pass your 20s, your exposure to strangers diminishes greatly. And many of us do not have kids.

> Once you pass your 20s, your exposure to strangers diminishes greatly

Could it be, at least partly, caused by having to commute to the office? When you work from home, it becomes so much easier to pick up a hobby and meet new people.

Re: We Can't Let People Work from Home, for Stupid Reasons

#40

Post by MattGaiser »

ryandrake wrote: post #17
MattGaiser wrote: post #3

> I can't imagine another day of long Zoom meetings. The pandemic really reinforced to me that so many of these are pointless, at least for many participants. I have played games with co-workers, gone to sleep, done freelance work, had lunch (away from my desk), and all manner of other things through pretty much every meeting over 1 hour that I have had this pandemic. Especially the ceremonies like retro (exercise in…

This one, I just don't get at all. If you have nothing to contribute to a meeting, and nothing to gain from listening, why are you joining the meeting to begin with? Just decline like a grown-up and get some actual work done. It doesn't do anyone any good to have you there on mute with the volume turned down, getting actual work done in the background. Nobody is going to notice you're gone, and if they do, who cares?…

Because, for example, the things that make retros pointless and wasteful (write down stuff and never consider it again) can challenge fundamentally the follow through ability of the department/manager/team members.
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