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A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

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Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#91

Post by closeparen »

rjknight wrote: post #10
periheli0n wrote: post #7

I expected to read about studio setups for live-streaming, e.g. on twitch. There are some musicians on twitch that have really awesome setups where one can discover so much visual detail while listening. I would have loved to read about some of those, perhaps even with a bit of advice how to build my own. Instead I got a luke-warm analogy of business attire and videoconferencing backgrounds. Mildly disappointing.

The point of the article is not "how to do it", but rather to observe that this kind of thing, previously a (relatively) niche concern, has become important to a general audience. The article even suggests that there's a business opportunity for fashion businesses to create tailored videoconferencing spaces, which is predicated on the notion that most people lack the time or inclination to set up their own bespoke se…

A lot of serious, famous people live in grand, nice houses in older neighborhoods with hopelessly oversubscribed Comcast. The CEO of my Fortune 500 company presented at a remote all-hands at about 0.25 frames/second. Now at that level, maybe you can spend the $10 million it would take to pull fiber to your house. But we’re not taking about buying some prosumer electronics here, we’re talking years of permitting and digging up the street. For mid-tier famous people the only hope they have of getting better upload bandwidth is moving to houses that already have it. That’s a bit more dramatic than going to a clothing store.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#92

Post by bluefirebrand »

handrous wrote: post #87
bluefirebrand wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. So placing higher value on people based on how they dress is a garbage practice used to profile people with poorer backgrounds and limit their social mobility, keep them out of better jobs, keep them out of upwardly mobile roles like management. It's "learn to play the fashion game or get fucked" We would be so much better off without that crap.

Sure, but we the same applies to any other skill or practice. Like learning to program. Or bathing. Or showing up to work on time (a much, much bigger problem than, say, not owning a suit, for the actually-poor—ask them, or their employers, and you'll get an earful). In the case of management, specifically, I'd think if someone's reached the point where they have a realistic shot at a management position, but haven't…

> In the case of management, specifically, I'd think if someone's reached the point where they have a realistic shot at a management position, but haven't figured out they need to dress for it, and also found the time & willpower to do so, that's signaling working as intended

It's signalling working as intended from the perspective of people who think they can tell everything they need to know about someone by how they dress.

And they're wrong. Every single one of them.

It allows a certain group to continue favoring their own group, or force people to conform to their group before being considered.

How you dress says nothing concrete about your ability to function as a human, as a worker, or a manager of people.

It is just another aspect of how attractive people get preference in society. We have to shed this eventually.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#93

Post by handrous »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #83
robocat wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have moved the goalposts. > I don't think you've ever been poor. You shouldn’t jump to conclusions - there are many people on hn from other countries where having access to a thrift store defines you as relatively wealthy. Either way, if you look like a hobo on your livestream setup, then people are likely to judge you. I wish the world was less judgemental, but you don’t get to tell others how to be, so you have…

> some people really care about how you dress and that is OK Extremely disagree. That is them trying to exert a form of control on me and it's absolutely bullshit.

So's... like, everything in society, really. Capitalism itself comes readily to mind, as an extreme form of soft social control that's actually not all that soft at all, in aggregate.

In the case of clothing, marking willful non-conformists is, notably, a significant part of its true (as in: accurate and useful) signaling value. This is where some counter-cultural fashions come from, in fact—an effort to make it crystal clear that one is dressing contrary to fashion norms on purpose and not by accident. To signal a distinction between the non-conformist and the ignorant or destitute.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#94

Post by periheli0n »

closeparen wrote: post #91
rjknight wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of the article is not "how to do it", but rather to observe that this kind of thing, previously a (relatively) niche concern, has become important to a general audience. The article even suggests that there's a business opportunity for fashion businesses to create tailored videoconferencing spaces, which is predicated on the notion that most people lack the time or inclination to set up their own bespoke se…

A lot of serious, famous people live in grand, nice houses in older neighborhoods with hopelessly oversubscribed Comcast. The CEO of my Fortune 500 company presented at a remote all-hands at about 0.25 frames/second. Now at that level, maybe you can spend the $10 million it would take to pull fiber to your house. But we’re not taking about buying some prosumer electronics here, we’re talking years of permitting and d…

I find it shocking that bad uplink in private homes is still a problem in the US. In times where a good proportion of public life happens on the web, most of shopping is done online, and media are dominated by streaming, why do people not run rampant against the lack of a decent wired uplink?

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#95

Post by skjoldr »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #68
jiofih wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may be surprised to realize that you’re the one being superficial here in equating style with money. Dressing well does not require money - what it signals is a form of sophistication or good taste in the case of high fashion, or tidyness and well-being for casual clothing. Millions of people dress nicely from Primark/C&A alone, and even fashion students get going on tight budgets sourcing second hand items. Much…

> what it signals is a form of sophistication or good taste in the case of high fashion, or tidyness and well-being for casual clothing. Caring about sophistication or good taste in fashion is a luxury that it takes money to afford. Even just the time investment it requires to be fashionable, to source nice clothes and plan outfits and all of that shit, it's absolutely the domain of people who have money. I don't thi…

You invest your time into your appearance so other people won't need to waste their time trying to determine if you're trustworthy. Appearance is a heuristic. Raging about it is counter-productive.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#96

Post by ghaff »

closeparen wrote: post #91
rjknight wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of the article is not "how to do it", but rather to observe that this kind of thing, previously a (relatively) niche concern, has become important to a general audience. The article even suggests that there's a business opportunity for fashion businesses to create tailored videoconferencing spaces, which is predicated on the notion that most people lack the time or inclination to set up their own bespoke se…

A lot of serious, famous people live in grand, nice houses in older neighborhoods with hopelessly oversubscribed Comcast. The CEO of my Fortune 500 company presented at a remote all-hands at about 0.25 frames/second. Now at that level, maybe you can spend the $10 million it would take to pull fiber to your house. But we’re not taking about buying some prosumer electronics here, we’re talking years of permitting and d…

Yeah. People with a spare room can spend thousands of dollars decking out a studio just so. But a lot of that money is pretty much wasted if they have glitchy Internet and there's not much they can do about other than renting a private office that has good Internet (which is probably an OK option for mid-tier famous people if they live near a city or other area with good network infrastructure).

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#97

Post by bingidingi »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #83
robocat wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have moved the goalposts. > I don't think you've ever been poor. You shouldn’t jump to conclusions - there are many people on hn from other countries where having access to a thrift store defines you as relatively wealthy. Either way, if you look like a hobo on your livestream setup, then people are likely to judge you. I wish the world was less judgemental, but you don’t get to tell others how to be, so you have…

> some people really care about how you dress and that is OK Extremely disagree. That is them trying to exert a form of control on me and it's absolutely bullshit.

The existence of society is a form of control on you. That's almost the entire point of society; standardized expectations and norms meant to maintain order.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#98

Post by akarma »

gumby wrote: post #47
rozab wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As they say, it's the skuomorphism. The original iPhone aimed to replace various existing things - instead of TV, we've got YouTube! Instead of a notepad, we have the notes app! No need to carry around paper maps with charming little pins stuck in anymore! This is equivalent to dressing up nicely as one would for an in-person meeting and plonking oneself down in front of a laptop webcam, according to the author. In t…

> of course the whole thing is a bit silly As goes with fashion as well. I’m not a practitioner myself (but married one, and am the parent of one) and I have observed that even the ones who take it seriously also treat it wil a sense of humor.

As someone quite into fashion (and worked in the space before), this is a very astute comment!

Fashion trends in the past few years have often progressed increasingly into a level of irony. It's become about what level of craziness/funkiness you can pull off while making it look intentional and attractive.

This includes hairstyles like dying your hair platinum blonde or purple and buzz-cutting it, or wearing loud, maximalist patterns, or even ironically wearing defunct fashion brands or cultural symbols opposite of your everyday life, like the popularity of Bass Pro Shops hats. The comeback of 'dad sneakers' and 'mom jeans,' while even retaining those monikers but in a positive way, are other good examples.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#99

Post by robocat »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #83
robocat wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have moved the goalposts. > I don't think you've ever been poor. You shouldn’t jump to conclusions - there are many people on hn from other countries where having access to a thrift store defines you as relatively wealthy. Either way, if you look like a hobo on your livestream setup, then people are likely to judge you. I wish the world was less judgemental, but you don’t get to tell others how to be, so you have…

> some people really care about how you dress and that is OK Extremely disagree. That is them trying to exert a form of control on me and it's absolutely bullshit.

You presuming to tell other people how they should think, according to your worldview, is also “bullshit”.

Accepting how other people have other opinions, rightly or wrongly, is just part of being a participant in this world.

If you interact with others as you are doing here, then perhaps you need to learn some wisdom.

Note that I agree that judging others by how they dress is bullshit + I have always hated it myself. I would also hazard a guess that you judge others for how they dress e.g. I expect you don’t like power dressers, or extremely fashionably dressed people.

Re: A good livestreaming setup is a well-tailored suit

#100

Post by [deleted] »

closeparen wrote: post #91
rjknight wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of the article is not "how to do it", but rather to observe that this kind of thing, previously a (relatively) niche concern, has become important to a general audience. The article even suggests that there's a business opportunity for fashion businesses to create tailored videoconferencing spaces, which is predicated on the notion that most people lack the time or inclination to set up their own bespoke se…

A lot of serious, famous people live in grand, nice houses in older neighborhoods with hopelessly oversubscribed Comcast. The CEO of my Fortune 500 company presented at a remote all-hands at about 0.25 frames/second. Now at that level, maybe you can spend the $10 million it would take to pull fiber to your house. But we’re not taking about buying some prosumer electronics here, we’re talking years of permitting and d…

[deleted]
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