They should ask Ubiquiti how to handle this. Their Unifi range of products don't start doing anything unless they're at least at 65°C
Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
451–460 of 516 posts
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#452Earlier quoted context omitted.
The put a non-automotive grade LCD in the original Model S because it was that LCD or nothing. The automotive screens didn’t exist in the size they needed and they weren’t at a stage in their company where they could design their own. They took a risk to achieve the product vision that they were determined to bring into the world given the technical constraints of the age. I’d say overall it paid off. IMO it wasn’t a…
I agree, it wasn't arrogance. Deliberately going forward with something in spite of knowing for certain that it's not fit for purpose is called engineering malfeasance, not arrogance.
It wasn't designed for a car, but they did run additional tests on it.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#453Earlier quoted context omitted.
Along the same lines, most hardware is designed under the assumption that you aren't significantly above sea level. Tons of medium-high voltage electronics have trouble with arcing once it turns on at 6000+ ft.
arcing involves ionizing air, right? I would have expected that the breakdown voltage of air increases with altitude, due to decreasing density of air.
Have you heard about vacuum tubes?
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#454I've been looking at the other comments on this article, and there is a couple of points that I haven't seen address by others that I think are pertinent.
1) What was it that Starlink wanted to beta test with customers? It might very well be that they shipped hardware with know environmental weaknesses, so not to hold up other parts of the project. While taking a hit on the reliability in edge cases.
2) We know that there are some dishes out there that have heat issues, but we don't know how many dish hardware iterations they have done. The failing dishes could very well be early prototypes that have know issues. Which are fixed in later revisions.
Generally speaking I don't see these reports as worrying. I've just come of 10+ years of working on SW on (indoor), embedded hardware. Having alpha and beta hardware with issues are common, you need some hardware to run your test and SW development on. Even if it is fundamentally flawed and you have to throw it away because of those weakness later. For those that only have experience of building software. What you are seeing here, is a view into the sausage factory, and just because it feels messy and doesn't line up with your expectations. Don't mean that they are doing it wrong.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#455Earlier quoted context omitted.
Because the cost would go up, and marketing becomes harder which makes it harder to get data and revenue to continue engineering.
Google shows me loads of industrial SBC devices that operate from -40 to +85C(!) that are under $200 USD. It's not reasonable for Starlink?
Starlink dish costs $500, and has an antenna and motor.
$500 seems cheap for what it does, and that makes sense if it’s cost optimized but doesn’t have the broadest climate zone tolerance.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#456Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#457Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a de-icing system. Starlink dishes have the opposite problem, they get too hot because they have to dissipate 100 watts electric energy plus the heat from the sun and the nearby rooftop. OK, maritime outfitters will sell you a climatized radome, which will set you back a few grand. Proper engineering costs money (can't have radar fail in the middle of the Strait of Malacca), and that's why Elon relies on his a…
> OK, maritime outfitters will sell you a climatized radome, which will set you back a few grand. To be fair, isn't the maritime market a bit like the aviation market, where a pack of 6 disposable AA batteries potted in a pack will cost you $43? ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1YjGLwfYSQ&t=37 ) On land with a good supply of fresh water (so, not in drought regions) I think you could probably cool a dish for a few d…
To be fair, isn't the maritime market a bit like the aviation market, where a pack of 6 disposable AA batteries potted in a pack will cost you $43?
Fair point, a portable AC sets you back 150 dollars or so, so with outdoor proofing and all, you can build a passable cooling system for 250 dollars. That would be the proper engineering solution, but it wouldn't look cool, like the steering yoke in the recent Tesla.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#458Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah but this isn't a 9. If it's really that low temp spec, it's gotta be kicking off most days for this and next month in AZ
What percent of customers don't experience thermal throttling in june? 90-99%? That's 1-2 nines. E: another comment mentions some cities in AZ are the hottest places in the world right now.
There are no nines in 60%.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#459I’m always surprised how poor engineering gets exposed in products I purchase being an Arizona resident. No, failing at 122F is not acceptable. If your hardware is exposed to outside conditions, it should operate easily below 32F, and well above 140F. Considering that phones can operate below 0F and near 122F, that’s embarrassingly bad. Same thing in vehicles. If you’re driving consistently at interstate speeds, you…
It's not trivial to do things at tens of gigahertz at a wide range of temperatures. They didn't engineer it this way because they didn't consider the existence of Arizona, Texas, and Southern California. The thermal limits exist because RF is absurdly difficult. Maybe in 30 years we'll have TCXOs and other RFICs that make it trivial. Right now it's not. tl;dr: Your phone doesn't have radios capable of talking on band…
I don't see why they don't just leave the antennas in the dish then run waveguide to a box in the shade.
Edit: after looking at a teardown I suppose it's because there are ~3000 channels. Woof.
Re: Starlink dishes go into “thermal shutdown” once they hit 122° Fahrenheit
#460Earlier quoted context omitted.
A few hundred thousand guys from less overheated areas might politely disagree.
Yeah and with the data they gather, they might be able to work out geographically appropriate versions. Eg add a smaller AIO water cooler to a hot climate area version, or some other hardening. Maybe it makes sense to apply to all versions? Can't know until you have some data. Sounds like a great and sensible beta program to me. Avoids premature optimisation, lets you see what actually goes wrong (where, and in what…
For fuck sakes people this is ambient temperature, it does not require beta testing, it requires someone to get off their ass and look at over a century of temperature data that organisations like nasa have been collecting.
I see people here hate the idea of startups or engineers being responsible for any kind of reliable service even though lives depend on it, and as this "SV spirit" infiltrates more of our life even coffee machines don't work without an internet connection, a subscribtion and software update.
Completely prosperous