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After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

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Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#221

Post by louthy »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #180
tetranomiga wrote: post #23

> On Tuesday, two House Democrats introduced legislation that would decriminalize all drugs in the U.S., shifting the national response to a public health model. The measure appears to have zero chance of passage. If that isn't just the perfect description of politics in the US, I don't know what is. I don't know what your political ideology has to be to think the War on Drugs is a good thing, after all the money was…

>If that isn't just the perfect description of politics in the US, I don't know what is. I don't know what your political ideology has to be to think the War on Drugs is a good thing, after all the money wasted, all the lives lost, all the people pointlessly locked up for things half the country can now do openly and legally. Well it does sound like you're equating the War on Drugs to the War on Marijuana. There are…

> Is it even possible to be a responsible Heroin user? Or even Meth?

Of course it is. The issues that you equate with the image of meth and heroin users are not as a result of the drugs; they’re nearly always a symptom of the problem, often mental health related.

Addiction is always a public health issue, no matter what form, whether it’s gambling, food, alcohol, drugs, …

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#222

Post by cwkoss »

dcolkitt wrote: post #32
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do we need to do next that would have the biggest effect, decriminalize cocaine/crack cocaine?

Legal and purity regulated heroin would have by far the biggest impact, because of the scourge of fentanyl deaths. If I had to choose between legal cannabis and legal heroin, I’d choose the latter on utilitarian grounds. (Although obviously I support both wholeheartedly.)

Another option is to legalize buprenorphine so it can be distributed cheaply over the counter without prescription. It outcompetes receptors to exclude heroin and is often prescribed for heroin cessation.

If heroin addicts had an easy option to not feel sick without that was cheaper and more available than heroin, I believe many would take it, and the heroin market would shrink - leading to lesser availability and fewer future addicts.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#223

Post by pope_meat »

iammisc wrote: post #194
pope_meat wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While a good thing, a losing battle in my opinion. You can perhaps convince your local authorities to not build another prison here this year, but somewhere else another prison still got built. There isn't enough people who give a shit, and an alarming amount of people who are rock hard for cruel punishment as a good thing. Unbuild the existing prisons. John Brown didn't write letters, he burned down plantations.

Are you advocating for the violent destruction of government property? Is that allowed on hacker news?

it doesn't have to be violent. structures feel nothing.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#224

Post by ineptech »

ElViajero wrote: post #8

> "The war on drugs was an absolute miscalculation of human behavior," said Kassandra Frederique, who heads the Drug Policy Alliance, a national group that advocates for total drug decriminalization. For me it would be incredibly interesting to know how much it was a miscalculation or actually it was very well calculated. The "War on Drugs" have failed to make USA safer, healthier or any other positive metric. But, i…

A great deal of the credit/blame for the modern drug war goes to Harry Anslinger[0]. Imagine being the nation's top enforcer of Prohibition - what do you do when it's repealed? Just close up shop, fire everyone, and turn the lights off before you lock the door?

This is a somewhat partisan issue and I'm far from unbiased, but reading his wiki page will convey most of the story better than a screed.

0: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_J._Anslinger

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#225

Post by cletus »

The War on Drugs was and is:

- Virtual signaling ("tough on crime") of the worst kind as it capriciously incarcerated minorities to the tune of millions of man-years;

- Fear-mongering for political power;

- Suppression of minorities, hippies and the anti-war movement; and

- Yet another form of voter suppression that has plagued the US for a long time.

It's like we learned nothing form Prohibition.

But the damage this has done goes well beyond the mass incarceration of minorities. It led to the enrichment of drug cartels and thanks to the ready supply of firearms in the US, the US armed the drug cartels and enabled the massive bloodshed that caused.

It's quite literally drugs into the US, money and guns out of the US.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#226

Post by pmoriarty »

camjohnson26 wrote: post #47
dcolkitt wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Legal and purity regulated heroin would have by far the biggest impact, because of the scourge of fentanyl deaths. If I had to choose between legal cannabis and legal heroin, I’d choose the latter on utilitarian grounds. (Although obviously I support both wholeheartedly.)

Given how addictive heroin is how do people supporting decriminalization suggest dealing with hard core addicts that can’t afford the drug? Giving it away for free in a clinic, hospitalizing hardcore users, letting legal dealers take on the risks directly?

"Given how addictive heroin is how do people supporting decriminalization suggest dealing with hard core addicts that can’t afford the drug?"

Cigarettes are even more addictive, and yet we aren't freaking out and throwing cigarette smokers in jail.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#227

Post by NaturalPhallacy »

ElViajero wrote: post #8

> "The war on drugs was an absolute miscalculation of human behavior," said Kassandra Frederique, who heads the Drug Policy Alliance, a national group that advocates for total drug decriminalization. For me it would be incredibly interesting to know how much it was a miscalculation or actually it was very well calculated. The "War on Drugs" have failed to make USA safer, healthier or any other positive metric. But, i…

>But, it has provided many with an excuse to pass restrictive laws, to win elections, to gain contracts with the government.

And militarize the police.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#228

Post by handrous »

tetranomiga wrote: post #23

> On Tuesday, two House Democrats introduced legislation that would decriminalize all drugs in the U.S., shifting the national response to a public health model. The measure appears to have zero chance of passage. If that isn't just the perfect description of politics in the US, I don't know what is. I don't know what your political ideology has to be to think the War on Drugs is a good thing, after all the money was…

> I don't know what your political ideology has to be to think the War on Drugs is a good thing, after all the money wasted, all the lives lost, all the people pointlessly locked up for things half the country can now do openly and legally.

A lot of people continue see locking up addicts as keeping dangerous people off the streets, so basically a good thing. They tend not to think significant rates of rehabilitation are possible, and that attempting it would be a waste of money that would also lead to higher crime rates.

> The most common-sense things don't even have a chance at passing

These same people would find it laughable—literally—that you think decriminalizing all drugs is common sense. They would see this as plainly, and wildly, out-of-touch with reality. Typical pie-in-the-sky and/or ivory-tower liberalism.

(these are not my views, to be clear)

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#229

Post by systemvoltage »

smoldesu wrote: post #176
systemvoltage wrote: post #64

It would be suicidal to challenge marijuana, since it is going against the current mob mentality on HN and elsewhere, but I am going to do just that. In my personal experience: - I think Marijuana should be legalized but it needs to be made uncool to consume just like Tobacco. Currently, it is the opposite. Social media loves weed. - Marijuana destroys personal ambition, productivity and self-esteem. - Marijuana is a…

It would be suicidal to challenge driving, since it is going against the current mob mentality on HN and elsewhere, but I am going to do just that. In my personal experience: - I think driving should be legal, but only allowed when you really need to get somewhere. - Driving takes away precious exercise that you otherwise would have gotten walking. - Driving is addicting, even though people say it's not. I can no lon…

Hah, you clearly put a lot of effort into this. Upvoted.

Re: After 50 years of the war on drugs, 'what good is it doing for us?'

#230

Post by Supermancho »

l33t2328 wrote: post #134
duped wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just "fine" with it, it's the current driving force behind the Republican Party.

I don’t think that’s true in the slightest.

You have to add the bottom 60% or "working poor" to make it true enough.
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