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Spatial Audio

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Re: Spatial Audio

#21

Post by SirCypher »

For a similar spatial audio experience I use foobar2000 and this plugin: https://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_dsp_dolbyhp It is quite old, but still works perfectly fine with the newest foobar versions.

Download foobar2000. Go to Preferences -> Components -> "Install..." and install the Dolby Plugin.

Then get your "dolbyhph.dll". Unfortunately you need to find it on the internet, as it is technically copyrighted and distribution of that file is probably not allowed. SHA1 for dolbyhph.dll v1.20.0.276 is 819FC1EE87B15996B89328061693F4D37FD7DB39

Then go to Preferences -> Playback -> DSP Manager. Add "Convert stereo to 4 channels" (sounds better and a little closer to the original imo) and "Dolby Headphone" to your active DSPs. Click on the 3 dots next to "Dolby Headphone" to open its configuration. Select your "dolbyhph.dll", Room model "DH2", lower amplification to ~70% (avoids clipping), no dynamic compression.

Apply, and then listen to any stereo song you want. Enjoy! Also try to experiment the DSPs (only Dolby, 4channels+Dolby, Upmix5.1+Dolby, ...) - they change live while you play a song.

Re: Spatial Audio

#22

Post by quenix »

tpush wrote: post #11
BugsJustFindMe wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would always prefer listening to the original intent of the artist. I always prefer listening to the thing that sounds better to me. I don't care about what the artist wants.

You’re downvoted, but enjoyment of music is obviously subjective. There is no “wrong” way to listen to music (or anything really).

Exactly. This thread is mindboggling.

Taste in music is purely subjective. If users enjoy listening to Spatial Audio, who are you to criticize it as a scam?

Re: Spatial Audio

#23

Post by onethought »

allears wrote: post #3
BugsJustFindMe wrote: post #2

I listened to the tracks. I like the spatial versions better. What are you going to do?

Lots of people like gimmicky things better, just like lots of people like to turn up the bass and treble all the way. But lots of us (and I'm a musician and audio engineer) appreciate high quality balanced distortion free audio, and want to hear the music the way the original artist intended. Just because you can make sounds bounce around in space doesn't make the music better, especially if the original recording wa…

Do you end up in a divide by zero situation when the artist intended you to turn the bass and treble all the way up? :)

Re: Spatial Audio

#24

Post by onethought »

matwood wrote: post #17
allears wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of people like gimmicky things better, just like lots of people like to turn up the bass and treble all the way. But lots of us (and I'm a musician and audio engineer) appreciate high quality balanced distortion free audio, and want to hear the music the way the original artist intended. Just because you can make sounds bounce around in space doesn't make the music better, especially if the original recording wa…

> and want to hear the music the way the original artist intended Curious how you know what the artist intended. Did they intend for the track to sound like you're at a stadium show or sitting in a small music studio with headphones on?

Or what happens with derived works? When you listen to a Coldplay song... do you follow their intent or Kraftwerk's intent? Oh no!

Or music that was composed before modern audio equipment - "If Bach had known about spatial audio! I know he would have loved it" :D

Re: Spatial Audio

#25

Post by tonetheman »

Just because of the sheer number of tracks there are in the world it is clear the quality here will vary wildly.

I really want to hear jazz like this. Specifically trios/quartets. Even if it is not the original and I can hear each musician separately I think it would be worth it.

Re: Spatial Audio

#26

Post by gmueckl »

I don't know how the downmix for headphones is created in this case, but if it spatializes the individual objects correctly, this removes the in-head-localization artifact that unprocessed stereo on headphones suffers from naturally, especially for sounds with a center pan. We have just trained ourselves to accept that headphones make sounds appear inside our heads. And I am pretty certain that the author is mistaking the acceptance of this artifact for a "prominent presence" of the vocals in the demo tracks.

Listening to a track that was intended for a stereo loudspeaker pair on headphones always creates a degraded experience if there is no further processing of the audio signal. Judging spatial audio without consideration of these differences leads to weird (wrong?) conclusions.

And why does it matter how expensive a certain pair of headphones is? If I want to know the price tag I can look it up!

Re: Spatial Audio

#27

Post by phiresky »

Cybotron5000 wrote: post #7

Spatial audio per se is not a scam, but its effective simulation is actually potentially rather complicated and I too worry about its successful implementation by Apple… Funnily enough, I had plans for a system to implement spatial audio using smartphones/headphones originally back in 2006 and more recently wrote an app for iOS trying to implement it (…prototype/demo. that I made worked pretty well - used what I lear…

From what I understand, to really get spatial audio from stereo headphones, you need to use a HRTF (head-related transfer function) specific to the person.

There's an open dataset of 50 different HRTFs [1] and a long video to compare them [2]. For me personally, only 2 of those 50 samples actually vaguely sound like audio is ever coming from in front of me. Left, right, and behind mostly works, but for most samples when it should be coming from in front of me it either comes from behind me or from above me.

So it shouldn't be really possible to get good spatial audio without 3d-scanning a persons head or at least making them go through a calibration step where they rate "where is the sound coming from?" . And it definitely shouldn't be possible to get any good results by pre-mixing the audio down to stereo before a user-specific transform is applied.

[1]: http://recherche.ircam.fr/equipes/salles/listen/index.html [2]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCXQp7swp5k

Re: Spatial Audio

#28

Post by zimpenfish »

danappelxx wrote: post #8
joeel84 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What speakers did you listen back on? I don't know anybody with a setup to play these back and I know some crazy audiophiles.

From footnote 8 on https://www.apple.com/apple-music/ > Works with AirPods, AirPods Pro, AirPods Max, BeatsX, Beats Solo3 Wireless, Beats Studio3, Powerbeats3 Wireless, Beats Flex, Powerbeats Pro, and Beats Solo Pro. Am I missing something?

> Am I missing something?

Yes, that's just for the automatic switch to Dolby Atmos. You can set "Dolby Atmos: Always" in Settings → Music.

> When you listen with compatible Apple or Beats headphones,8 Dolby Atmos music plays back automatically when available for a song. For other headphones, go to Settings > Music > Audio and set Dolby Atmos to Always On.

Re: Spatial Audio

#29

Post by donbrae »

matwood wrote: post #17
allears wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of people like gimmicky things better, just like lots of people like to turn up the bass and treble all the way. But lots of us (and I'm a musician and audio engineer) appreciate high quality balanced distortion free audio, and want to hear the music the way the original artist intended. Just because you can make sounds bounce around in space doesn't make the music better, especially if the original recording wa…

> and want to hear the music the way the original artist intended Curious how you know what the artist intended. Did they intend for the track to sound like you're at a stadium show or sitting in a small music studio with headphones on?

I imagine the artist approved a (stereo) mix they heard on decent studio monitors and maybe stereo headphones too. I’m not sure how they’d feel about someone else then creating an atmos/spacial audio version without their involvement. Mixing is integral to the artistic part of making recorded music.

I’d be interested to know whether the tracks appearing on Apple Music are being created from the original tracks/stems (i.e. properly remixed), or whether an algorithm is being applied to the same stereo mixdown that would have created a standard (stereo) master.

Re: Spatial Audio

#30

Post by m3kw9 »

From what Apple say about spatial audio, you cannot just run it thru a converter. You need the tracks in their individual original recording before the mixing to be able to do it properly. So I’m not sure how a handful of chop shops are doing all that.
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