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New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

dataprotectioncontrol.org

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Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#231
post #218
post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't find that. Could you be more specific?

"Filter Lists" settings-tab -> expand "Annoyances" -> Fanboy's is by far the most popular one. Otherwise read the pages they link to / view the content (many have descriptions in content) - many of them are intended to work with Fanboy's, but if not you may have excessive duplicates.

Thank you!

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then Europeans complain when the rest of the world geoblocks them.

Where are these fictional Europeans who want strong enforcement of privacy laws and complain about geoblocking? The whole point is that either you follow our laws or you lose access to Europe. Geoblocking is just self-regulation.

Here's one. I hate it how I can no longer access 90% of local US news websites.

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are these fictional Europeans who want strong enforcement of privacy laws and complain about geoblocking? The whole point is that either you follow our laws or you lose access to Europe. Geoblocking is just self-regulation.

Here's one. I hate it how I can no longer access 90% of local US news websites.

Every single time I've had this problem I've just used the Google cache or archive.org

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#234
post #7

Reminder that we've already had a spec for it. In the 90s! And it even has been implemented in the Internet Explorer: https://www.w3.org/P3P/ It did absolutely nothing for privacy. Google has been sending bogus P3P headers that broke IE's implementation and allowed all cookies. Adtech companies don't want users to have an easy opt-out. They didn't want P3P. They didn't want DNT. They will not want this new spec, unle…

This exactly. This is also why I never feel "ashamed" when sites ask me to please disable my ad blocker because when I block ads they'll go out of business. Or why I'll always decline even "user respecting" ads on sites. We're fighting the ad and tracking industry here, the internet equivalent of a gang member with a shiv and a length of pipe. I'm not going to fight nicely. I'll deny you any chance and any method I g…

The ad industry eventually ruins any medium it touches, and is responsible for spreading misinformation and propaganda that have killed millions.

It ruined print when every other newspaper and magazine page had an ad mixed in with the content. Sure you could get the paper for free, but how much content are you actually reading?

It ruined television when an hour-long show is interrupted several times to show 15 minutes of ads.

And now it's ruining the web with the advent of ad tech and the brilliant minds that get paid millions to think of new ways of squeezing more value out of people's attention. Web sites are riddled with ads now even worse than in the popup days. I have to navigate a legal minefield of dark patterns to ask them to please not track me or sell my data.

These are just the ways it ruins content and user experience. What about the misinformation? The lies from the tobacco industry, the political ads that overturn democracies, astroturfing and embedded marketing...? The list of shady and downright evil practices is too long to mention.

Advertising is a scourge on humanity. It needs to be strongly regulated and companies as influential as Google and Facebook need to switch to user respecting business models, for the sake of all of us.

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just a small reminder for people using Firefox and ublock origin: you can remove almost all cookie prompts by enabling the annoyances filters in the addon settings

Anyone not using Firefox/Ublock; you can use NoScript to block the banners, and a lot of other adtech (including some paywalls such as Bloomberg) as they are all JS-powered. It's quite surprising to see how many JS plugins are in operation on a typical consumer site, and satisfying to know they were all blocked unless expressly permitted :)

And if you don't want to or can't install noscript, you can use my little hack https://noscript.it/ to view a page without javascript.

Note that it is a hack/poc and does not always work, especially the x-frame-detection is iffy so if you try it and just see a blank page try the "enable proxy" checkbox. I use it every now and then on iOS to get around some especially obnoxious JS, but if there were more users I would be more motivated to improve it (hint hint:-)

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For example making the "Accept all cookies" button require less effort than only accepting necessary cookies, which almost every page does. Like those that make you uncheck 10 or 20 entries one by one.

Or like those that make the "Accept all cookies" button green and the "accept necessary" white/colorless/default.

I recently came across a website that makes the "Accept all cookies" button secondary and the the "accept necessary" primary. It's such an effort to actually press the primary button — I have been so trained by the completely disdainful behavior of the majority of websites.

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#237

This week I told iOS safari to block all cookies. It’s really not that awful. In fact, it’s kind of fantastic. I use a second browser (Google Chrome) for “signed-in stuff”. Try it. (Although the fact that I just posted this from safari reminds me I’m not 100% up to speed on which-browser-for-what-activity discipline.)

I wish it could accept the cookies and delete them when you leave. It would break fewer websites.

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thing is, how is regulation supposed to ever keep up with the rapid advancements of technology and advertising and the lobbies that come with all that revenue? Capital and technology need not respect sovereign borders and laws as long as they can keep one step ahead of enforcement and still get enough revenue. The laws and lawmakers are fundamentally slower and weaker and poorer; by the time CCPA et al have an actual…

Simple the law should be written in a technology agnostic way. Something along the lines o f"Services shall not track user behavior beyond what is necessary to render service, and user behavior shall not be sold to, shared with, or otherwise made useable by third parties without user consent" Then it doesn't matter what technology you come up with in the future it is covered.

That doesn't really work long term. "necessary to render service" might include advertising dollars. And who is a "third party"... If ad networks reorganize into a cooperative that offers services directly to publishers in the manner of AWS, are they still a third party? And user consent, what if it becomes a requirement to consent before you can access data, or opting out gives you diminished functionality...

None of that is far fetched. Facebook, Google, Apple etc. all track and use first party data. If anything this just consolidates advertising power into the hands of an oligarchy that's already largely above antitrust law.

The law is never simple, exhaustive, or agile when it comes to regulating technologies.

GDPR has been the most successful of the bunch and all it really did was force a bunch of cookie notices and deletion processes. That still largely depends on people being lazily accepting advertising.

Any proposed law that singlehandedly destroys ad tech is unlikely to either pass or stay relevant for more than a few months.

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or like those that make the "Accept all cookies" button green and the "accept necessary" white/colorless/default.

I recently came across a website that makes the "Accept all cookies" button secondary and the the "accept necessary" primary. It's such an effort to actually press the primary button — I have been so trained by the completely disdainful behavior of the majority of websites.

I saw the exact same thing and was surprised too! I wonder if it was a site that was on HN...

I press "accept all" by accident and thought "wow".

Re: New browser signal could make cookie banners obsolete

#240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is not the case. The fines are up to 2% of annual global turnover. This scares companies. You are wrong. The initial fine is much, much lower and companies have so long to dabble in wilful ignorance that it is at the moment not something that has teeth. Companies are like bullies, they don't respect threats - only harm.

> initial fine is much, much lower and companies have so long to dabble in wilful ignorance Another diluent: the maximum fine is practically the lesser of 2% and the NPV of business in that European country, or, expansively, in Europe. If you have little business in Europe, it’s cheaper in some cases to simply close shop.

I'm pretty certain an actual fine (not ceasing operations) has a limit of max(10M€, 2% worldwide revenue of previous year) and double if you're antithetical to GDPR. Also, it's per infringement and isn't a yearly free pass to continue once you're fined.

Companies are not doing much because enforcement is lacking, and in case you get caught, most fines are in the neighborhood of reasonable rather than instant liquidation.

[0] https://noyb.eu/en/irish-dpc-handles-9993-gdpr-complaints-wi...

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