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Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

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Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#151

Post by pmoriarty »

threatofrain wrote: post #121
pmoriarty wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, seeing a movie on the Himalayas is no substitute for visiting the Himalayas, and that's no substitute to living in the Himalayas. But I'd rather have there be movies on the Himalayas than not, even when we are aware it's not a perfect substitute for the real thing. The perfect is the enemy of the good.

The standard here is being barely adequate, not perfect. Anyone who is part of an immigrant community knows how hard it is to be adequate. That's why you pass on this optimism to the next generation while you blindly chase cultural fads, hoping your kids will fit in. You smile and nod your way through. Anyways, the call here is for community integration, not for individual action.

Are you saying fictional media are incapable of having a barely adequate portrayal of immigrants?

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#152

Post by unknown_error »

smt88 wrote: post #112
threatofrain wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google News gives you precisely this portfolio of vendors. Why would anyone subscribe to a single news vendor? I'd also advise adding WION, Al Jazeera, Axios, and The Guardian + BBC.

Google News is a dumpster fire. They include Sputnik and other govt propaganda sites from oppressive regimes.

It's gotten significantly worse over time. Are there better alternatives that collate news, by topic, from multiple sources?

Newsvoice was an app that tried to crowdsource that job instead of using algorithms. It very quickly became an alt-right cesspool, presumably because those are the same people who feel disenfranchised by FAKE NEWS LIBERAL MEDIA and so flock to alternative communities.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#153

Post by prepend »

robmccoll wrote: post #114
Noos wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. Like a recent cancel attempt was Scott Cawthon, creator of the game series Five Nights at Freddy's. His crime? Voting for trump. No really, that's it. His games weren't political, and while he was open about who he was, he pretty much seemed to be inoffensive in practice. But since his fanbase has a lot of LGBT, they felt betrayed because he did so, and as far as i know he was definitely not trolling them…

But what exactly is this "cancel" attempt? Is he legally prohibited from expressing his views somewhere? It seems more like his former fans deciding they don't want to support him and "voting with their feet". This guy can still produce whatever games he wants, say whatever he wants in a public forum, make his own websites declaring whatever he wants to declare, probably get on TV and talk about it, get licensure to…

> But what exactly is this "cancel" attempt?

Basically it’s just like calling for a boycott and removal of apps and removal from social media platforms.

It’s not calling for execution, just for reducing the person’s ability to communicate and/or make a living.

This seems like a basic understanding of what “cancelling” is although it gets spun up quite a bit because lots of people like arguing about it.

But I think it’s a “bad thing” TM to call for boycott and removal from social media. Not that it’s illegal or shouldn’t be allowed, just that it’s dumb and people who do it are dumb.

Similar to how Tipper Gore was dumb in the 80s/90s for calling for the “cancelling” of rappers and whatnot.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#154

Post by UncleOxidant »

> “Until you can passionately make arguments for both sides,” she says, “you don’t understand the issue.”

While this may be true for many issues, I don't think this is true for all issues. Imagine someone saying that just prior to the civil war on the issue of slavery, for example.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#155

Post by whimsicalism »

TinkersW wrote: post #143
sandyarmstrong wrote: post #124

> I would be shocked if 60+% of American film characters are identifiably Christian How often do you see Christmas used as a plot device? Or a church used as a setting? Or a priest character? I would be shocked if context didn't imply that > 95% of American film characters are Christian.

Christmas isn't Christian

Actually, I would flip this and say that going to church weekly is not a necessary condition for being within Christian sphere of influence.

Xmas is most certainly Christian.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#156

Post by prepend »

antiterra wrote: post #147
Noos wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. Like a recent cancel attempt was Scott Cawthon, creator of the game series Five Nights at Freddy's. His crime? Voting for trump. No really, that's it. His games weren't political, and while he was open about who he was, he pretty much seemed to be inoffensive in practice. But since his fanbase has a lot of LGBT, they felt betrayed because he did so, and as far as i know he was definitely not trolling them…

Trump’s positions included his belief that people should be able to be fired solely for being LGBT+. You know, like cancelled. So, people who are or care about LGBT+ share the information that Cawthon voted in a way that could harm them. That’s not ‘siccing a tiger’ for any disagreement whatsoever.

Trump was cancelled by the election, so that makes sense. People vote for lots of reasons so assuming that a voter supports every single issue is simplistic.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#157

Post by whimsicalism »

elefanten wrote: post #135
sandyarmstrong wrote: post #124

> I would be shocked if 60+% of American film characters are identifiably Christian How often do you see Christmas used as a plot device? Or a church used as a setting? Or a priest character? I would be shocked if context didn't imply that > 95% of American film characters are Christian.

Christmas doesn’t signify religion in America. And I can’t remember the last time I saw church in a movie that wasn’t a comedy using the setting for a set-up

> Christmas doesn’t signify religion in America

Yes it does...

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#158

Post by Noos »

XorNot wrote: post #59
Noos wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. Like a recent cancel attempt was Scott Cawthon, creator of the game series Five Nights at Freddy's. His crime? Voting for trump. No really, that's it. His games weren't political, and while he was open about who he was, he pretty much seemed to be inoffensive in practice. But since his fanbase has a lot of LGBT, they felt betrayed because he did so, and as far as i know he was definitely not trolling them…

> But since his fanbase has a lot of LGBT, they felt betrayed because he did so The LGBT community was [1] and still are violently attacked for the mere act of existing. The idea that people's political beliefs, what, don't affect other people who live in that country? Is insane. Voting is a political act which affects others. If someone votes for a politician who gives cover and support to a group which - as an exam…

Reading about Trump on this, he seems to flipflop more than be hateful or anything; in one breath he supports same sex marriage, in another he restricts certain federal aspects like gender dysphoric individuals being allowed in the military. The actual content of what he did for LGBT seems to be a minor negative mostly surrounding limiting federal power over employment; he refused to put up any fight against same sex marriage and there's a lot of "well it could LEAD to this" going on.

I don't think this is a cancellable offense. I think if you are going to sanction someone for voting, it has to be real and clear danger of present harm, not "they are republicans, you know they hate us."

Like, if that's the case, why not just sanction everyone who voted for him?

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#159

Post by nitrogen »

bpodgursky wrote: post #103
throwaway894345 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do the same thing, and I've noticed that this "they don't present the other side" thing is getting worse with time. I recently read [this HuffPo article][0] about how only 1% of American film characters are identifiably Muslim ; however, nowhere in the article does it even mention the share of Americans who are Muslim, nor the share of movie characters that are of other religions. These things are certainly obvious…

Interestingly Mormons are 2% of the US population (twice the Muslim %), and I can't think of a single openly Mormon character in any TV show I've ever seen.

There have been movies, such as The Other Side of Heaven.

But as a former Mormon myself I think entertainment is more interesting if it focuses on what we have in common despite our differences, rather than focusing solely on amplifying differences.

Re: Some Americans are breaking out of political echo chambers

#160

Post by Impassionata »

miked85 wrote: post #137
Impassionata wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the problem with concepts of polarization: when one side is completely corrupt, reporting on that corruption (that is, observing basic reality) becomes a political act easily described as 'biased.' The Republican party is fascist.

Posts like yours are a great example of the polarization.

Once you send a mob at the Capitol to interfere with the peaceful transition of power, there can be only one side that calls itself American.
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