Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 95 posts

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#71

Post by yawaworht1978 »

Elon should be happy that on Mars, there will be neither a regulatory body nor environmental groups.

Maybe they should just cheat like VW did? /S I see some objections here saying the level of "green" should be more related to the cars itself, not production. I find this is a bit like enjoying the sausage but looking away from how they are made, because it is rather nasty.

Tesla has a way of presenting a " clean" product , but plays very dirty on all other fronts, like pricing lies , fsd promises which never materialize etc

I think the whole supply chain , including production do contribute to how green a product is.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#72

Post by oboes »

tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

In that case the objections seem reasonable.

Here in Belgium there is a growing controversy surrounding a chemical plant in Antwerp leaking PFOS [1] in the environment. Due to this, scientists from the University of Antwerp now advise local residents against eating eggs laid within 15km of the plant [2].

Of course there seem to be no plan to hold the responsible company accountable.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfluorooctanesulfonic_acid

[2] https://www.brusselstimes.com/news/belgium-all-news/173456/3...

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#73

Post by tankenmate »

oboes wrote: post #72
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

In that case the objections seem reasonable. Here in Belgium there is a growing controversy surrounding a chemical plant in Antwerp leaking PFOS [1] in the environment. Due to this, scientists from the University of Antwerp now advise local residents against eating eggs laid within 15km of the plant [2]. Of course there seem to be no plan to hold the responsible company accountable. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/…

Does Tesla use PFOS in any of it's processes?

Aside from that I can't find any sources that list any of the chemicals that the complaint is objecting about. Any links would be handy.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#74

Post by tankenmate »

Mrdarknezz wrote: post #29
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

Well building a battery factory in EUs worst CO2 polluter kinda makes no sense from an environmental viewpoint. Better to build it in Sweden or France which have a heavy Nuclear/Hydro mix in their grid.

That is a bit of a strawman argument as then you should also argue for stopping all industry in Germany that has a heavy use of electricity (which battery manufacturing doesn't really compared to other things like aluminium smeltering).

Germany is moving to more renewable sources of energy and Tesla also plans to put solar panels on the rooves of its buildings.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#75

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

durnygbur wrote: post #30

Good luck setting up in Germany a manufactury alternative to Daimler, BMW, Audi, or VW. It's literally a threat to their existence and they'll react accordingly. Sometimes it shows how disconnected Americans are from the local European realities. Even if Tesla will succeed they'll have to fly workers from Ukraine, Branderburg is a demographical desert. Czechia, Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania are desperate to…

There is no demographical desert, it's well in commute reach of Berlin. Maybe lacks S-Bahn, but they could bring them in by bus, like the FAANGS do/did theirs from SF to Silicon Valley.

edit: I just looked it up on Openstreetmap with the traffic overlay, next stop for the S-Bahn is about 5km away, wouldn't even need to bus them in over long distance, just a tiny shuttle service from either 'Erkner', or 'Grünheide, Fangschleuse, Bahnhof' as can be seen here:

https://openstreetmap.de/karte.html?zoom=13&lat=52.42458&lon...

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#76

Post by durnygbur »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #75
durnygbur wrote: post #30

Good luck setting up in Germany a manufactury alternative to Daimler, BMW, Audi, or VW. It's literally a threat to their existence and they'll react accordingly. Sometimes it shows how disconnected Americans are from the local European realities. Even if Tesla will succeed they'll have to fly workers from Ukraine, Branderburg is a demographical desert. Czechia, Poland, Slovakia, Hungary, and Romania are desperate to…

There is no demographical desert, it's well in commute reach of Berlin. Maybe lacks S-Bahn, but they could bring them in by bus, like the FAANGS do/did theirs from SF to Silicon Valley. edit: I just looked it up on Openstreetmap with the traffic overlay, next stop for the S-Bahn is about 5km away, wouldn't even need to bus them in over long distance, just a tiny shuttle service from either 'Erkner', or 'Grünheide, Fa…

Dude, these are not FAANG dream jobs. Qualified workers will earn gross 3.5k EUR/month, unqualified 2.7k EUR/month [1]. These salaries barely pay the rent in Berlin. Tesla is already trying to search in western Poland apparently unaware it's a similar wasteland.

[1] https://gazetalubuska.pl/tesla-gigafactory-kusi-zarobkami-i-...

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#77

Post by vt85 »

durnygbur wrote: post #76
LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no demographical desert, it's well in commute reach of Berlin. Maybe lacks S-Bahn, but they could bring them in by bus, like the FAANGS do/did theirs from SF to Silicon Valley. edit: I just looked it up on Openstreetmap with the traffic overlay, next stop for the S-Bahn is about 5km away, wouldn't even need to bus them in over long distance, just a tiny shuttle service from either 'Erkner', or 'Grünheide, Fa…

Dude, these are not FAANG dream jobs. Qualified workers will earn gross 3.5k EUR/month, unqualified 2.7k EUR/month [1]. These salaries barely pay the rent in Berlin. Tesla is already trying to search in western Poland apparently unaware it's a similar wasteland. [1] https://gazetalubuska.pl/tesla-gigafactory-kusi-zarobkami-i-...

And what is the average salary of a developer in Berlin? Because I happen to know it's about that range. And it does pay the rent, and there isn't much better option. So, dude, this apparently are very good salaries for Berlin.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#78

Post by durnygbur »

vt85 wrote: post #77
durnygbur wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, these are not FAANG dream jobs. Qualified workers will earn gross 3.5k EUR/month, unqualified 2.7k EUR/month [1]. These salaries barely pay the rent in Berlin. Tesla is already trying to search in western Poland apparently unaware it's a similar wasteland. [1] https://gazetalubuska.pl/tesla-gigafactory-kusi-zarobkami-i-...

And what is the average salary of a developer in Berlin? Because I happen to know it's about that range. And it does pay the rent, and there isn't much better option. So, dude, this apparently are very good salaries for Berlin.

This is a salary in Berlin for an inexperienced bootcamp graduate. For new arrivals the rents in the city have reached at least 1-1.5k EUR per month long time ago.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#79

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

durnygbur wrote: post #76
LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no demographical desert, it's well in commute reach of Berlin. Maybe lacks S-Bahn, but they could bring them in by bus, like the FAANGS do/did theirs from SF to Silicon Valley. edit: I just looked it up on Openstreetmap with the traffic overlay, next stop for the S-Bahn is about 5km away, wouldn't even need to bus them in over long distance, just a tiny shuttle service from either 'Erkner', or 'Grünheide, Fa…

Dude, these are not FAANG dream jobs. Qualified workers will earn gross 3.5k EUR/month, unqualified 2.7k EUR/month [1]. These salaries barely pay the rent in Berlin. Tesla is already trying to search in western Poland apparently unaware it's a similar wasteland. [1] https://gazetalubuska.pl/tesla-gigafactory-kusi-zarobkami-i-...

Dude, maybe someone living on Hartz IV/ALG II in Marzahn, or something similar would enjoy it? Berlin isn't just Kreuzberg/Neukölln/Friedrichshain, you know?

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#80

Post by durnygbur »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #79
durnygbur wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, these are not FAANG dream jobs. Qualified workers will earn gross 3.5k EUR/month, unqualified 2.7k EUR/month [1]. These salaries barely pay the rent in Berlin. Tesla is already trying to search in western Poland apparently unaware it's a similar wasteland. [1] https://gazetalubuska.pl/tesla-gigafactory-kusi-zarobkami-i-...

Dude, maybe someone living on Hartz IV/ALG II in Marzahn, or something similar would enjoy it? Berlin isn't just Kreuzberg/Neukölln/Friedrichshain, you know?

Yes they might be the target demographics, now only 40000 of them is needed. Arbeitsamt is printing the letters probably ;)
Post reply on HN