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The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

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Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#911

Post by dogman144 »

myfavoritedog wrote: post #732

I know that most people won't; but if this article is some kind of major a revelation to you, I hope that you take some time to re-evaluate your information sources. You really should think more carefully about how you detect bullshit. There were those who were sounding the alarm about this lab leak hypothesis well over a year ago. The overwhelming media narrative to look away from that hypothesis and smear those who…

I'll push back here... if you actually want the data on this, it's not a clean MSMFox and co split, via "analyzing over fifty-five thousand online media stories, five million tweets, and seventy-five thousand posts on public Facebook pages garnering millions of engagements."

There's this general situation where yes, there is that ecosystem 1 and downstream sources OP mentioned, and there is the ecosystem 2 (Fox and downstream sources).

However, former POTUS and ecosystem 1 cycled between themselves a fair bit, ecosystem 2 and former POTUS cycle, so by proxy eco1 and eco2 are cross-linking to each other in a sense, and so on.

I'm not telling you that there is no good way to parse info sources out there, but I am telling you the "MSM vs. other" delineation that OP is calling for awareness of doesn't really exist if you study the actual information flow... which this team did.

If you want my advice, read primary sources on events that matter to you. Studies, court documents, and so on. It's what that whole confusing ecosystem uses as well, and you can get the raw data without the analysis.

- the study: https://cyber.harvard.edu/publication/2020/Mail-in-Voter-Fra...

- discussion on the study: https://www.lawfareblog.com/lawfare-podcast-yochai-benkler-m...

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#912

Post by cindarin »

harryf wrote: post #6
bartart wrote: post #2

This is the most shocking article I have ever read in my life. I'd ask everyone to please read it because it is incredible. One thing I did not realize is that US researchers who conducted gain of function research tried to downplay and discredit the possibility of the virus originating from the wuhan lab. There was an anti-lab theory Lancet statement signed by scientists, and "Daszak had not only signed but organize…

It gets worse - gain of function research was banned under Obama until the ban was lifted in 2017 under Trump - https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3... I can’t find sources for this right now but apparently Dr Anthony Fauci played a key role in getting the ban lifted. He’s also the head of the NIAID ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthony_Fauci ) which (apparently) is the ultimate source for…

I appreciate that you provided sources and yet the conversation seems to be focused on just your baseless conjecture.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#913

Post by altcognito »

myfavoritedog wrote: post #845
altcognito wrote: post #826

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Im still curious what you think this article really reveals. It makes a lot of unsupported claims. Fox News Is mainstream news. It literally is the most watched network, well beyond all those you listed as being “mainstream news”. Yet they serve the same biased, lack of balanced coverage as the sites you listed. In fact, the article even points out how White House advisors (on Fox, OAN) put out the WIV origin story o…

Fox News Is mainstream news. It literally is the most watched network If you view Fox News as one of many competing news outlets, sure, it's got a big voice. But I'd urge you to view it in terms of collective narrative. The left-leaning narrative bubble is far larger than Fox News by more than an order of magnitude. When CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS, NBC, NPR, PBS, the AP, NYT, WaPo, ESPN, late-night comedy hosts, Twitter, F…

I noticed you left out AM radio and a host of newspapers owned by Rupert Murdoch. A bunch of those other sources bend over backwards to carry a both sides narrative to nobody’s benefit.

Facebooks top groups are all conservative. I realize that they end up getting a lot of attention for the spread of misinformation and getting moderated into oblivion for it, but Facebook is a huge hub of conservative influence as the past two elections cycles pretty much demonstrated.

This is why I don’t hold conversations online. I had other points that weren’t worth addressing apparently and this isn’t really going to lead anywhere so good luck to you.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#915

Post by ReptileMan »

loveistheanswer wrote: post #881
menomatter wrote: post #822

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the article mentione one of the reasons: " When Trump himself floated the lab-leak hypothesis last April, his divisiveness and lack of credibility made things more, not less, challenging for those seeking the truth."

Its a great example of how blinding ideology and partisan politics is. For people who did not have their identity tied to either political side, the lab leak theory was always an obvious possibility.

Unfortunately those three of this kind of people didn't manage to find fourth for a game of bridge.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#916

Post by vladTheInhaler »

member492 wrote: post #550
bartart wrote: post #2

This is the most shocking article I have ever read in my life. I'd ask everyone to please read it because it is incredible. One thing I did not realize is that US researchers who conducted gain of function research tried to downplay and discredit the possibility of the virus originating from the wuhan lab. There was an anti-lab theory Lancet statement signed by scientists, and "Daszak had not only signed but organize…

What is even more shocking is that the mass media and big tech have done everything to keep this covered. Most of the revelations are nothing new if you read alternative news sources where true journalism still exists. Big tech and mass media are now more like China state television, they decide what and how to tell you something based on what they want you to believe. The greatest threat of our times is not the Coro…

> From all over the world renowned scientists, doctors, politicians, lawyers, noble price winners, and many more, are being totally silenced and criminalized.

This sentence literally tells me nothing. Which specific people are being "criminalized" and by whom?

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#917

Post by shkkmo »

stevenhuang wrote: post #675
sbagel wrote: post #587

The amount of wildly delusional oppression complex in this thread is staggering, HN has really gone downhill. On the media 'not taking it seriously' - because there was no evidence whatsoever outside of conjecture and it was being pushed heavily by misinfo merchants. No grand conspiracy. Skepticism is a good default approach to take for info heavily pushed by such sources with no solid evidence. There were tons of ar…

You must not have been paying attention. Here's one case of someone stating the true goals of those who promote the lab leak hypothesis is to promote anti Asian sentiments... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26547263 It's hard to believe how one can reach such a daft conclusion. There are many others.

That is not what that comment is saying. It discusses effects, it does not ascribe motivation.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#918

Post by weaksauce »

stef25 wrote: post #622
kelnos wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure if I ran an organization that funds a bunch of labs that do virus research, and a global pandemic started in the neighborhood of a lab doing virus research, and people started floating the theory that the virus leaked from that lab, one of the first things I'd do is call my grant-funding team and ask them if we funded that lab. If Fauci didn't do that, he's a strange dude.

100K from a 5B budget is peanuts and you couldn't reasonably expect the person at the top to know the details of what each recipient of 100K is doing exactly. If all of the 5B is spent on coronavirus research then it's a different story. Most likely it's spent on an incredibly wide array of topics.

to expand on just how small comparatively that number is... 100,000 seconds is a little over 1 day worth of seconds... 5 billion seconds is a little bit over 158 years of seconds.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#919

Post by bena »

sbagel wrote: post #587

The amount of wildly delusional oppression complex in this thread is staggering, HN has really gone downhill. On the media 'not taking it seriously' - because there was no evidence whatsoever outside of conjecture and it was being pushed heavily by misinfo merchants. No grand conspiracy. Skepticism is a good default approach to take for info heavily pushed by such sources with no solid evidence. There were tons of ar…

Not to mention, the "origin of COVID" fails my test of relevance.

If it came from a lab, does anything change? No, not really. It's still a virus that we need to protect against.

The only thing that would change any sort of response is if COVID was deliberately released. And that doesn't even change the medical side of the response, just the political side.

> HN has really gone downhill.

Yes, it has, but mentioning the reason for that will bring the brigade of the very same element that has made it go downhill.

Re: The lab-leak theory: inside the fight to uncover Covid-19’s origins

#920

Post by inancgumus »

TLDR: Demaneuf soon discovered that there had been four incidents of SARS-related lab breaches since 2004, two occuring at a top laboratory in Beijing. Due to overcrowding there, a live SARS virus that had been improperly deactivated, had been moved to a refrigerator in a corridor. A graduate student then examined it in the electron microscope room and sparked an outbreak.
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