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Apple-Developer Relations

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Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#91

Post by smoldesu »

actuator wrote: post #69
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #63

It's a two-way street. Despite selling less than 20% [1] of smartphones across the world, its App Store accounts for over 64% [2] of app revenue. Apple and its developers somehow built an App Store that people are willing to spend more money on. If it's purely thanks to developers, why isn't there more revenue on Google's Play Store? [1] https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share... [2] https://sens…

This feels like such a disingenuous argument. Most of the countries where Android sells well are countries with way lower purchasing power and this would even reflect in sales of all software, not just Android one. Also, Android phones in China are not necessarily using Play Store. Most of the sales of Android phones are at a lower price bracket which might indicate the purchasing power of customers, so they would na…

I hate seeing these downvotes, because you're absolutely right. The parent comment is missing that the average price of these Android phones is often an order of magnitude less than the price of the average iPhone, so it makes sense that the phone which costs 10x as much has people willing to spend more money. It's not rocket science, and arguably not even economics.

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#92

Post by tshaddox »

shkkmo wrote: post #82
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #63

It's a two-way street. Despite selling less than 20% [1] of smartphones across the world, its App Store accounts for over 64% [2] of app revenue. Apple and its developers somehow built an App Store that people are willing to spend more money on. If it's purely thanks to developers, why isn't there more revenue on Google's Play Store? [1] https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share... [2] https://sens…

If Apple's AppStore is really so good, it should be able to withstand a little healthy competition from 3rd party stores. Who knows, a little competition might even inspire the AppStore to become even better?

One could argue that this is a bit like saying “if McDonald’s burgers are so good, they should be able to withstand putting competing restaurants’ burgers on their menu.”

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#93

Post by nemothekid »

actuator wrote: post #38
atonse wrote: post #2

I am deeply invested in the Apple ecosystem and yet, can’t wait for the DoJ to throw the gauntlet on the App Store. I really hope they get broken up, with the App Store being extracted into a separate business.

App Store should be just the start. Mobile web for more than 50% of the US users is also restricted to Apple's whims. They should be forced to allow competing browser engines(not just skins on Safari engine) on the platform. If Microsoft couldn't even bundle IE on Windows, it should be possible to make an alternative browser(along with engines) for iOS.

>They should be forced to allow competing browser engines (not just skins on Safari engine) on the platform.

While this sounds good in theory, what would likely happen is Safari would be replaced with Chrome.

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#94

Post by smoldesu »

tshaddox wrote: post #92
shkkmo wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If Apple's AppStore is really so good, it should be able to withstand a little healthy competition from 3rd party stores. Who knows, a little competition might even inspire the AppStore to become even better?

One could argue that this is a bit like saying “if McDonald’s burgers are so good, they should be able to withstand putting competing restaurants’ burgers on their menu.”

No, this is more like asking McDonald's not to blow up new restaurants within a week of them coming to town because they didn't "ask permission" from them first.

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#95

Post by tobr »

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #63

It's a two-way street. Despite selling less than 20% [1] of smartphones across the world, its App Store accounts for over 64% [2] of app revenue. Apple and its developers somehow built an App Store that people are willing to spend more money on. If it's purely thanks to developers, why isn't there more revenue on Google's Play Store? [1] https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share... [2] https://sens…

iPhones are more expensive on average, hence used by people who spend more money on average.

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#96

Post by ksec »

At D5 [1], What did Steve & Bill Gate admire in the other?

Bill: Steve’s taste,

Steve: Microsoft’s ability to partner.

Apple is basically repeating a lot of their early mistakes. Some of those lessons Steve took it to heart when he returns to Apple from NeXT.

>This isn’t about the 30%, or the 15%,.......It’s about what Apple’s leadership thinks of us and our work.

There is also another point Marco didn't mention. It is not your customers either. Apple has been very clear in all of their communications. The user of iPhone, are Apple's customers. Even the third party Apps, they are accessing Apple's customers. And hence the relationship is very much not a partnership. Since Apple claims ownership on both the Apps and the customers. In the name of privacy and user experience.

>but Apple uses their position of power to double-dip.

Finally! Someone in the Apple community use the term double-dip! A term Apple has used against Qualcomm and sent a whole PR team to damage their reputation.

>But the leaders have already shown us who they really are, what they really think of us, and how little they value our work.

Unfortunately Tim Cook isn't the type of person who understand this. You should probably listen to his testimony to make your own judgement. But after the Epic Vs Apple trial it became very clear why Steve said Tim Cook isn't a product person. There are quite possibly zero product sensibility within Tim Cook. And I am not sure who is in-charge of the PR now either. Their message are delusional, hypocritical and reminds me a lot of Google in the 00s. I missed Katie Cotton's era.

[1] (76:30 ) https://on.wsj.com/2zWWqPU

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#97

Post by Apocryphon »

It seems like a year ago there was a big dust-up over the 30% cut and Apple's management of the App Store- does anyone remember that? I believe it might've related to the Hey controversy. Or the House antitrust hearings. I just remember a storm of unhappiness, followed by WWDC 2020 and everyone just forgetting about it until the Epic lawsuit picked up again.

Blast from a year's past:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23504251

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23571320

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#98

Post by criddell »

actuator wrote: post #66
handrous wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be careful what you wish for. Safari's forced presence on the most lucrative mobile platform is the reason we don't, for all practical purposes, have only one browser engine, period , now. Which is something only nerds like us care about on a technical level, so I don't think the typical user is harmed or bothered by all browsers on iOS sharing an engine, but the social harm of Google 100% owning the Web would reach…

While your concern is genuine, Apple almost has 60% of the active mobile device market share(according to Statcounter). I think my concern is two fold. - Apple holds the gateway to both App Store and Web(through standard support). Having worked on web apps in the past, I truly admire the amazing distribution capability the web provides. I can spin up an obscure Linux distro and my web app works on it as long as a bro…

I get what you are saying about web apps, but I hope Apple doesn't open up to more browsers.

It seems like every additional sensor or OS feature that is exposed through the browser is used as an additional way to erode privacy and security.

Plus I like that there are incentives for developers to make native apps for anything non-trivial. In my experience well written web apps use too much bandwidth, battery, and memory compared to well written native apps.

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#99

Post by handrous »

cageface wrote: post #85
handrous wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be careful what you wish for. Safari's forced presence on the most lucrative mobile platform is the reason we don't, for all practical purposes, have only one browser engine, period , now. Which is something only nerds like us care about on a technical level, so I don't think the typical user is harmed or bothered by all browsers on iOS sharing an engine, but the social harm of Google 100% owning the Web would reach…

I don't understand this argument. End users don't care about browser engines and they can install "Chrome" right now. But most iOS users don't.

Google's not pushing it hard on iOS, and it can't offer enhanced features or tailor (ahem) its sites to run better on the Chrome engine on iOS. That makes it a harder sell, and the "Google sites all works better on Chrome (because we made sure they do...) download it here!" ads they had success with on desktop would simply be lies, if they tried that. They also can't get other apps to embed their engine so they get those sweet, sweet analytics from those, too. FB would likely do the same (probably with a fork of Chrome, for obvious reasons).

Re: Apple-Developer Relations

#100

Post by alexkcd »

015a wrote: post #71
AceJohnny2 wrote: post #63

It's a two-way street. Despite selling less than 20% [1] of smartphones across the world, its App Store accounts for over 64% [2] of app revenue. Apple and its developers somehow built an App Store that people are willing to spend more money on. If it's purely thanks to developers, why isn't there more revenue on Google's Play Store? [1] https://www.counterpointresearch.com/global-smartphone-share... [2] https://sens…

I'm not 100% sure on this, but I've suspected that this often-quoted disparity has something to do with China, and how Apple still controls iOS app distribution in China but the Play Store has much lower usage. So, you get weird aggregates because the total revenue numbers don't include the Chinese specific Android app stores (which, by the way, are insane; Huawei takes a 50% commission on game sales in their's, and…

iOS apps are more profitable on a per install basis. So the discrepancy cannot be explained by there being multiple Android stores. Your hypothesis in brackets is the more likely explanation.

Source: I worked on an app with millions of paid subscribers.

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