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Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

fastcompany.com

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Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#21

Post by mywittyname »

lenitabinol wrote: post #9
kevingadd wrote: post #3

"One worker’s company “had everyone come into the office for an outdoor luncheon a week ago,” according to a post" Some of the stuff companies do truly baffles me. It's only the beginning of June, you can't really assume your whole team is fully vaccinated. Why would you bring everyone in for lunch and then send them home? All downside and near-zero upside. It'd be another matter if it was a full day event where you…

Every 16+ year old in the Bay Area has had access to a vaccine for 6 weeks.

People have still been putting it off. And it still takes a few weeks for full immunity to kick in.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#22

Post by throwawayboise »

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #10
emc3 wrote: post #2

In-office work needs to be compensated differently than WFH. They will try to decrease WFH compensation initially, like the loss of benefits threat in the article, but the number of potential employers is higher for WFH workers, giving them leverage.

Compensation changes are hidden in “cost of living” adjustments.

Inflation is already here. Miserly COLAs are not going to cut it for the next few years.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#23

Post by addicted »

aplummer wrote: post #13
commandlinefan wrote: post #6

Well, if remote work isn't feasible (for the reasons stated), neither is offshoring. Or outsourcing. Or physical satellite offices.

I’m not sure that sells it, because I don’t think offshoring and outsourcing is feasible…

The flip side is that if remote work is absolutely the same, then offshoring and outsourcing are also.

Why have your employees work remotely in a city 100 miles from their original office at 80-90% of the cost when you can have them be 1000 miles from the office at 30-40% of the cost.

If you find employees in Central and South America they would also be in the same timezone.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#24

Post by _y5hn »

kevingadd wrote: post #3

"One worker’s company “had everyone come into the office for an outdoor luncheon a week ago,” according to a post" Some of the stuff companies do truly baffles me. It's only the beginning of June, you can't really assume your whole team is fully vaccinated. Why would you bring everyone in for lunch and then send them home? All downside and near-zero upside. It'd be another matter if it was a full day event where you…

If you have proper tracing and know there's small infection rates in your area, we do this all the time, but still keep the distance.

You could go all isolation and lockdown mode for over a year. Either due to fear, or due to lack of control. However, at some point the costs outweigh those risks.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#25

Post by irq11 »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #7
irq11 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vaccines have been readily available to anyone who wants them (in the US) since mid April, even in the highest demand parts of the country. If you are not vaccinated, at this point, there is no excuse. (edit: obviously, I’m assuming the article is talking about a company in the US, since the article is about the US .)

IANAD, but I'm sure there are some medical contraindications for certain individuals, such as people who are immunocompromised, that may legitimately keep them from being vaccinated. That's why achieving herd immunity is important, and my understanding is that we aren't quite there yet. Never change, HN.

Herd immunity is not a fixed vaccination percentage pulled from Anthony Fauci’s latest media appearance. It’s the immunity level at which cases stabilize and begin to decline. It is defined by observation.

Cases are at all-time lows in the most vaccinated locations, and are dropping rapidly nationwide.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#26

Post by Broken_Hippo »

irq11 wrote: post #5
kevingadd wrote: post #3

"One worker’s company “had everyone come into the office for an outdoor luncheon a week ago,” according to a post" Some of the stuff companies do truly baffles me. It's only the beginning of June, you can't really assume your whole team is fully vaccinated. Why would you bring everyone in for lunch and then send them home? All downside and near-zero upside. It'd be another matter if it was a full day event where you…

Vaccines have been readily available to anyone who wants them (in the US) since mid April, even in the highest demand parts of the country. If you are not vaccinated, at this point, there is no excuse. (edit: obviously, I’m assuming the article is talking about a company in the US, since the article is about the US .)

Only if you are in certain parts of the world. If you aren't, then no. No they are not. For the record: I'm in Norway. Vaccine rollout has been slow - and it hasn't been my turn yet.

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#27

Post by irq11 »

mnd999 wrote: post #18
irq11 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vaccines have been readily available to anyone who wants them (in the US) since mid April, even in the highest demand parts of the country. If you are not vaccinated, at this point, there is no excuse. (edit: obviously, I’m assuming the article is talking about a company in the US, since the article is about the US .)

Depends on the country.

The article is about the US. Did you read it?

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#28

Post by dcolkitt »

tstegart wrote: post #11
kevingadd wrote: post #3

"One worker’s company “had everyone come into the office for an outdoor luncheon a week ago,” according to a post" Some of the stuff companies do truly baffles me. It's only the beginning of June, you can't really assume your whole team is fully vaccinated. Why would you bring everyone in for lunch and then send them home? All downside and near-zero upside. It'd be another matter if it was a full day event where you…

I'm finding there are a certain group of people who are really struggling socially, and to them this is a good thing, even with the risks. Some people lost their whole social network when the office went home, and they long for it to come back. As a person who can only handle so much social interaction, it is baffling, but to others, it is baffling to stay home all the time.

A lot of those people are only struggling in the first place because the broken office-first model required them to relocate to a metro where they have no family or social network. This is particularly bad in the tech industry, because the major tech metros are notoriously unsocial. People on the West Coast tend to have fewer friends and be less outgoing[1], so it's particularly hard to meet people when you relocate there from somewhere friendly like the Southeast.

In a remote-first model people could stay located in the areas that suit them best socially. They could live in the hometowns they grew up in, or by their families, or in their college towns. Concentrated industries like tech are particularly bad, because there are so few metro options, compared to the geographic flexibility of doctors or accountants. Office-first in tech is a siren song of loneliness. First it draws us far away from our loved ones, which leaves us with no other option for meaningful human connection outside the workplace.

[1]https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/We-seem-to-be-missing-0-...

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#29

Post by geodel »

throwawayboise wrote: post #16

One worker complained that the manager “wanted butts in seats because we couldn’t be trusted to [work from home] even though we’d been doing it since last March,” adding: “I’m giving my notice on Monday.” I've seen this with my current employer. Their message has been that going forward at some point, "Working remotely is not an option." There's really no reason I can't work from home. I've been doing it since March…

All great points. It is similar for me. Server/App admin plus some coding. Most meetings happen over webex because teams are distributed across cities in different time zones. But working from home is not an option. Also actually flying to different offices to collaborate face-to-face is not an option either because "Hehe who flies mere devs for meetings, isn't there a slack / zoom / webex?"

Re: Why workers are calling BS on leaders about returning to the office

#30

Post by thrower123 »

addicted wrote: post #23
aplummer wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not sure that sells it, because I don’t think offshoring and outsourcing is feasible…

The flip side is that if remote work is absolutely the same, then offshoring and outsourcing are also. Why have your employees work remotely in a city 100 miles from their original office at 80-90% of the cost when you can have them be 1000 miles from the office at 30-40% of the cost. If you find employees in Central and South America they would also be in the same timezone.

We just have twenty years of experience that any initial cost savings generated by outsourcing are illusory and come due with interest on the back end.
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