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Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

theguardian.com

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Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#291

Post by pc86 »

ornornor wrote: post #229
new_here wrote: post #182

Take a moment to comprehend those numbers: FY18/19 - under $10bn profit FY19/20 - $314.7bn profit (3/4 of Ireland's GDP) and paid no tax on it. > The subsidiary, which collects licence fees for use of copyrighted Microsoft software around the world, recorded an annual profit of $314.7bn in the year to the end of June 2020, according to accounts filed at the Irish Companies Registration Office. Its profits jumped from…

And seen in another thread: Microsoft is lobbying the US govt to spend 250 million to make more software engineers by introducing computer courses in schools so that there are more SE on the market in the future so that they can hire for cheaper. Meanwhile, individuals are paying 20–50% income tax. What a wonderful world.

This argument comes up a lot but nobody is paying 50% income tax in the US. Even if you make a million dollars a year in W2 income, in California, which has the highest marginal tax rate, you'll pay roughly 40% effective, almost entirely to the federal government. Realistically you're going to make a lot less than that W2, which drives the effective rate down considerably, and as remote work becomes more of an expectation, living in a state with high income taxes will become more and more of a choice. Plenty of states have bustling urban centers and low single digit income taxes.

Also I think it's pretty disingenuous to assume that MS wants to see computer courses taught in school to drive down the cost of labor.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#292

Post by adolph »

TimPC wrote: post #217
adolph wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People not knowing their tax burden: feature or bug?

The original purpose wasn’t to hide taxation but to effectively get more money via interest by the government getting paid sooner.

As I understand it in the US, the average taxpayer’s experience is that of annual taxes but the reality is that taxes are paid quarterly and settled on an annual basis. The self employed see this more clearly. Those in employer-employee relationships don’t see it since the employer sends the quarterly check to the various income taxing jurisdictions. Any interest made from the temporary storage of cash is probably more favorable to the employer than the government since the government spends cash faster than it arrives. The government does not escrow tax remittances in an interest generating account and then withdraw it all at year’s end.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#293

Post by [deleted] »

ornornor wrote: post #229
new_here wrote: post #182

Take a moment to comprehend those numbers: FY18/19 - under $10bn profit FY19/20 - $314.7bn profit (3/4 of Ireland's GDP) and paid no tax on it. > The subsidiary, which collects licence fees for use of copyrighted Microsoft software around the world, recorded an annual profit of $314.7bn in the year to the end of June 2020, according to accounts filed at the Irish Companies Registration Office. Its profits jumped from…

And seen in another thread: Microsoft is lobbying the US govt to spend 250 million to make more software engineers by introducing computer courses in schools so that there are more SE on the market in the future so that they can hire for cheaper. Meanwhile, individuals are paying 20–50% income tax. What a wonderful world.

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#294

Post by brobdingnagians »

Reminds me of "rich man's war and poor man's fight". The rich are always moralizing about how everyone should pay their fair share, but it is the poor man who ends up paying. Why do we think that a system controlled by the rich man will ever really allow it to overtax the rich. Better to stop raising taxes that only the poor will pay.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#296

Post by rorykoehler »

cheph wrote: post #238
m12k wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, the current corporate tax laws basically punish single-nation companies, while giving multinationals a free pass. International tax laws desperately need an overhaul.

Is Ireland not a democracy? Can't they vote to change their own tax laws if they have a problem with them?

We can and there is a huge swell of support for Sinn Fein a nationalist left wing party (the political arm of the IRA). The two centre right parties FF & FG (FFG) that have held power since Ireland gained independence are very pro the current taxation policy and have up until now had an iron grip on power due to a culture of voting for whoever your parents voted for. This is slowly changing. Loads of Irish people don't want this. The only problem I see is that we have structured our whole economy around FDI and there are no realistic proposals to revamp our economy to a similar level of wealth through different means. Enough people in Ireland will continue to vote for FFG because they get preferable tax treatment on investments as landlords, backroom deal etc. Ireland is a corrupt mess tbh.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#297

Post by ccvannorman »

Grustaf wrote: post #189
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You miss the part where small companies have to compete against each other so organizing together would be impossible whereas entities like Microsoft, Facebook, Apple, Google, etc. are basically unregulated monopolies in their respective fields so they get to steer the ship as they please.

It wouldn't be impossible at all, you can of course cooperate with competitors to lower your taxes while competing for customers. Not that you necessarily need to band together with your competitors for this, there are plenty of companies out there.

What is the minimum viable income to take advantage of these tax loopholes? Would I need to form an LLC or C-Corp (does it matter)? As long as big corps are cheating, let's be transparent about the data and how everyone can act the same way. I'm all for taxing Microsoft et. al. the correct amount but in the meantime let's democratize this action. Maybe it will prompt legal change for everyone.

I'd love to see a Playbook for Tax Loopholes for Everyone.

- minimum annual profit required

- legal steps to take

- recommended law firms

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#298

Post by Grustaf »

ceejayoz wrote: post #281
Grustaf wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you live in Europe. The _average_ Danish taxpayer pays 45% in income tax. This is not counting payroll taxes that the company pays on top of that, or of course 25% on everything you buy. So the overall effective tax rate is more like 75% than 50%. There used to be a slogan in Sweden, "half left", meaning people wanted to keep at least half of their gross pay. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/201…

As an American citizen who paid $30k for healthcare last year and looking at college for two kids in less than a decade, I'd take the Danish deal laid out in that article pretty happily.

I live in Denmark, and frankly speaking I think most Europeans view the US as a kind of developing country. It can be nice if you're well off, but so can Rio or Capetown. Thinking about it Capetown is much nicer than most US cities.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#299

Post by jermaustin1 »

KMag wrote: post #113
menzoic wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which country is your corp registered in? In U.S. you can register and S. Corp to avoid being double taxed.

The disadvantage of an S. Corp is that you don't have any flexibility in evening out profit distributions between good years and bad years, right?

technically true, since every year you take a cash distribution of the profit, BUT you then roll that into the following year and all distributions are tax free... cuz you already paid taxes on it.

Re: Microsoft Irish subsidiary paid zero corporate tax on £220bn profit last year

#300

Post by TheGigaChad »

waterglassFull wrote: post #39
malux85 wrote: post #2

I have to pay 40% of my income as income tax. I have HAD ENOUGH. This is infuriating. What can we do?

If you are fortunate enough to be in a position where you're earning enough to pay 40% tax then great for you! Paying tax is good for society, what's not great is companies avoiding it. The latter doesn't negate the former.

[dead]
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