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When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

theguardian.com

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Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#121

Post by thedmstdmstdmst »

dalbasal wrote: post #113
licebmi__at__ wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice review. In a sense I find this something akin to the late David Graeber point on it’s column about bulling. How you can find data pointing towards the human society propensity for violence, and also data of human society propensity for cooperation and refusal to engage on violence even when confronted with losing their way of living, although he also raises the point when historically there has been more propens…

IDK if its a modern bias or a recurring one, but people are very drawn to the idea of a core human "nature:" what we are when all the surface level stuff is stripped away. The way the conversations I've had tend to go is ever more contrived scenarios. Eventually it gets to spaceships carrying sperm and eggs to be raised cultureless by robots. You need to avoid scenarios like these, where the boys know about raising c…

Yes of course, the natural course of development of humans is to do away with all other humans. Then you can be fully human.

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#122

Post by filleduchaos »

beachy wrote: post #34
filleduchaos wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Distasteful" and "dumb" are far from the same thing, and the second world war happened for the former and not the latter.

Pointless pendatry over words doesn't move discussion forwards. I wouldn't personally use either of those words to describe Nazis, which is largely what WWII "happened for".

I'm curious about what the pointless pedantry is in drawing a distinction between "stupid" and "morally abhorrent".

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#123

Post by goodcanadian »

frosted-flakes wrote: post #54
trhway wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Bounty mutineers' settlement on an uninhabited island also comes to mind https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutiny_on_the_Bounty#Pitcairn

Imagine having that as your family history. There are still 50 or so descendants still living on Pitcairn today.

And several hundred descendants living elsewhere (Norfolk Island, Australia, New Zealand).

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#124

Post by MomoXenosaga »

dalbasal wrote: post #113
licebmi__at__ wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice review. In a sense I find this something akin to the late David Graeber point on it’s column about bulling. How you can find data pointing towards the human society propensity for violence, and also data of human society propensity for cooperation and refusal to engage on violence even when confronted with losing their way of living, although he also raises the point when historically there has been more propens…

IDK if its a modern bias or a recurring one, but people are very drawn to the idea of a core human "nature:" what we are when all the surface level stuff is stripped away. The way the conversations I've had tend to go is ever more contrived scenarios. Eventually it gets to spaceships carrying sperm and eggs to be raised cultureless by robots. You need to avoid scenarios like these, where the boys know about raising c…

There is an idea that after the bombs fall we all turn into raping and pillaging marauders. I have no idea why people find this idea comforting.

In reality villages will be built, laws written and religions made up.

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#125

Post by dr_dshiv »

MomoXenosaga wrote: post #124
dalbasal wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IDK if its a modern bias or a recurring one, but people are very drawn to the idea of a core human "nature:" what we are when all the surface level stuff is stripped away. The way the conversations I've had tend to go is ever more contrived scenarios. Eventually it gets to spaceships carrying sperm and eggs to be raised cultureless by robots. You need to avoid scenarios like these, where the boys know about raising c…

There is an idea that after the bombs fall we all turn into raping and pillaging marauders. I have no idea why people find this idea comforting. In reality villages will be built, laws written and religions made up.

These villages better build defenses against the marauders or all is for naught. And of course, the best defense is a good offense. And... Fast forward to the presently peaceful times of mutually assured destruction!

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#126

Post by MomoXenosaga »

filleduchaos wrote: post #119
anotherman554 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a distinction without a difference- one could argue a less primitive species wouldn't have found itself caught in world wars. The man-children starting world wars are paralleled by the children-children killing each other on the island.

Reducing the historical and contemporary reasons why humans engage in war to people being "man-children" is a level of sticking-my-head-in-the-sand that I hope to never attain. I've never understood the urge to think of people and things one morally/politically disagrees with as simply stupid, braindead or immature - but there seem to be way too many people who seem incapable of contending with the idea that humans c…

I have had the privilege to visit concentration camp museums. I actually didn't have the feeling these were unintelligent savage places. It was actually trying to be orderly, efficient and exceedingly bureaucratic. These institutions were very much a part of civilization. Everything was thought through.

They weren't run by man children.

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#127

Post by garmaine »

vkou wrote: post #118
garmaine wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Blow up that report card and frame it on your wall. That's high praise.

Depends on the opinion. Being stubborn about insisting that water isn't wet makes you a fool, not an unappreciated genius.

Context.

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#128

Post by raviisoccupied »

chriskanan wrote: post #5
Zamicol wrote: post #2

My high school's district required students to read The of Lord of the Flies. My freshmen English teacher hated the book so much he broke district requirements and told my class he was giving everyone A's on that assignment. He asked the class to read any substitute book in its place. To this day I still consider him to be a wise teacher.

I used to be a voracious consumer of fiction, but somehow critical reading of Lord of the Flies knocked that out of me in sophomore high school English. I think it was all the deeper meaning analysis I was forced to do moreso than the book. It just seemed like we were going far beyond the author's intention in a joyless analysis exercise.

I did a degree in English Literature. It didn't make me hate reading, it just really, really complicated my relationship with the activity.

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#129

Post by lrem »

watwut wrote: post #102
kuu wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know why you're being downvoted when it's clear your question is out of curiosity. High effort reviews are common on Goodreads, why? Because it's a community about passionate readers and probably those who write the very detailed reviews have enjoyed reading some other reviews and want to contribute back to the community. I think it's the same reason as people contributes to wikipedia: for the sake of sharing…

> I don't know why you're being downvoted when it's clear your question is out of curiosity. It is an odd question on the internet where people regularly and normally put a lot of effort into reviews, blog posts, discussion forums comments and so on. That coupled with question about affiliation probably makes people interpret is as not questions out of curiosity, but rather as sleazy way to introduce doubt on the aut…

Good point. That was not my intention. But my communication skills before caffeine digests are not where I would want them to be :/

Re: When six boys were shipwrecked for 15 months (2020)

#130

Post by askvictor »

Zamicol wrote: post #2

My high school's district required students to read The of Lord of the Flies. My freshmen English teacher hated the book so much he broke district requirements and told my class he was giving everyone A's on that assignment. He asked the class to read any substitute book in its place. To this day I still consider him to be a wise teacher.

I'm curious how many of that class read it purely as a result of his request. Though I suspect they might have read it in a different light.
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