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Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

theguardian.com

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Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#191

Post by Dylan16807 »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #90
failwhaleshark wrote: post #73

94.9% pure, organic, outrage, clickbait FUD. This feels like an "you're either with us or you're against us, Amazon B A D"-article. The central thesis is misleading and wrong because it's NOT "unlimited, direct sharing of your WiFi to whatever Amazon users happen to fall and scrape their knees outside your home because they can't skateboard," it's "likely low-rate connectivity for other Amazon users' devices over Blu…

So you're planning on just letting this happen on your devices; I get it, too much hassle, etc. No need to try and get others to not opt out if they choose to though, that sounds like a lot of effort for someone who's okay with it. Or are you paid by Amazon to promote it?

Don't.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#192

Post by stingrae »

duped wrote: post #188
stingrae wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% this. as a device maker, sidewalk is a potential game changer for low power connectivity and finally a path to lorawan finding wide spread adoption

I don't like the idea of my neighbors piggybacking off my data and power hookups. Why aren't device manufactures figuring out how to make things that don't require something like sidewalk to exist? It's not that difficult to run cable and use power over ethernet.

the key use case for sidewalk is away from your home. Ethernet doesn't fix this. Presently cellular is the only real solution.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#194

Post by kergonath »

local_dev wrote: post #148
monkeynotes wrote: post #103

Why the dickens isn't this opt-in? Now we live in a world where a corp can sit on your own home network and do business using your bandwidth without you explicitly agreeing. Not to mention the potential for security issues.

We all know the answer to this. It absolutely should be opt-in, but they know that around 96% of people will never opt-in. See: iOS 14.5 privacy changes.

Making something opt-out because you know that people would not opt in voluntarily is a class of evil on its own. It is simply fraud and deception.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#195

Post by hermitdev »

deanCommie wrote: post #176
remarkEon wrote: post #68

Article doesn't mention it, but this is how you opt-out (there are others but this one has screenshots). https://www.tomsguide.com/reference/what-is-amazon-sidewalk Added to my list for the next time I'm on the phone with my parents, for our (weekly at this point) how-to sessions on "stopping the industry I work in from spying on you". I really, really wish product managers would understand the kind of ecosystem they…

"extend the low-bandwidth working range of devices to help find pets or valuables with Tile trackers, and help devices stay online even if they are outside the range of their home wifi" Seems like a genuine customer problem. If you want to set up smart lights through your back yard, or a smart sensor at the edge of your driver, they might not have WiFi connectivity to the rest of your house. Hence the Sidewalk metaph…

> Seems like a genuine customer problem. If you want to set up smart lights through your back yard, or a smart sensor at the edge of your driver, they might not have WiFi connectivity to the rest of your house.

That sounds like a "you" problem, not a "me" problem. If "you" are setting up smart devices where "you" don't have connectivity, "you" should provide the connectivity, not "me". (Note: I don't have a problem with devices piggy backing on/extending their owner's network).

TFA mentions possible issues with FTC and TOS violations with customers' ISPs. But what about overages? Who's liable for those? Is there going to be a metered breakdown of network usage? Will AMZN cover costs of overages due to neighbor usage? What about potential liability issues? Infosec issues?

This just sounds like a too easy setup for a class action lawsuit.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#196

Post by lsaferite »

enraged_camel wrote: post #172
dlhavema wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like I don't have the update yet. I don't see this menu option.

If you don't see the menu option that means none of your paired devices are compatible with Sidewalk. List of supported devices at the bottom: https://www.cnet.com/home/smart-home/amazon-sidewalk-will-cr...

I had the option a few days ago and now it has disappeared in both my phone and my wife's.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#197

Post by jkaplan »

Can someone elaborate on the privacy concerns (e.g. with Amazon "becoming a pseudo-ISP")? It seems like most (if not all) of the network use would be Amazon devices anyway, which is data they already have. Additionally, as far as I know, Amazon isn't really in the business of selling ads or customer data, so they seem like they'd be relatively trustworthy (compared with, say Google, who's entire business is based off of selling ads, and also literally sell routers.) Is the concern just the threat that they could abuse this data? Is it just general "big company getting even bigger / having more data is bad" sentiment? Genuinely curious.

(The security concerns make sense to me -- most people and businesses assume their home network is closed, and this theoretically opens an attack vector. Asking specifically about privacy.)

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#198

Post by slownews45 »

howolduis wrote: post #180
slownews45 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very unlikely that you have title to amazon's software. You may have a license to use their device and the related software subject to their terms, but that is VERY different than classical ownership. All the megacorps have gone this direction. Amazon is going to give you a constantly improving Alexa system and ecosystem and in return you are going to let them use sidewalk in most cases.

this is the equivalent of saying: "in return of living in a well-maintained nice neighborhood, you should not password-lock your wifi"

Traffic over sidewalk will egress to internet from Amazon AS numbers.

You need to be careful about open wifi which despite the claims is different - traffic will egress as you - so if someone jumps on and does some stupid stuff, you can create a fair bit of pain for yourself.

Most folks experience free improvements to echo after purchase. That is part of the value people see in these devices. The network effects get stronger with time. All of the use of these systems requires agreements to TOS that mean you really don't own / control the device, amazon does. Worst cast, when the megacorps close your accounts, you can actually lose access to lots of stuff that it feels like you "own". All your photos, all your email, maybe media content, books etc.

Re: Amazon US customers given one week to opt out of mass wireless sharing

#199

Post by Taniwha »

stingrae wrote: post #190
Taniwha wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

except that, unlike ble, lora lives on bands that are not the same world wide - there is no region 3 ISM band - here in NZ the US ISM band is right in the middle of one of my cell phone company's bands

this is true but in practice it's not a big deal. Companies don't usually do a single sku for the whole world especially with the certification requirements.

I (pre-covid) visit the US a lot and often bring stuff back. I'm used to turning off/switching the US-DECT/etc when required but in this case Amazon has snuck extra functionality into my home without my knowledge.

Of course when the radio inspector comes knocking on my door because Amazon has loaded the wrong firmware into my box (without my knowledge) it's me who's breaking the law, not Amazon

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