Live data from Hacker News

Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

dailydot.com

501–510 of 619 posts

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#501
post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anything above 100K is sky-high, and you need to have drunk a lot of the SF kool-aid to think anything else. That the cost of living in SF is so high that a wage like that doesn't cover basic living costs is not because the wages aren't high enough.

Hold on there, cowboy. 100k was maybe "sky high" 20 years ago. 100k in most large cities is not. When your modest house costs $800k USD, a car costs 30k, auto insurance is $1600 a year, groceries are 10k a year (looking at you, Toronto), just how in the hell is 100k "sky high"? $80k was a decent salary in a mid-size city 15 years ago. Just because six figures seems like a lot of money to you doesn't mean it's a lot o…

These people could work from anywhere.. especially today that working remote has become the norm, but even if working remote wasn't an option there's no reason they have to live in an expensive city. They could commute, just like most of the rest of us who can't afford to live in rich cities.

Wikimedia is a global foundation, so they don't have to live in the US even.

They could have easily hired someone from a country with a much lower cost of living.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"there are a small number of companies in a small number of locations paying those high salaries to a small number of highly talented developers" Are they really that talented, or are they just good at whiteboarding algorithm questions that they almost never actually use on the job?

It’s a myth that whiteboarding problems are the only criteria used in FAANG interviews. Being able to complete coding challenges is necessary but not sufficient for getting one of these jobs. These companies that spend $300K or more on their developers aren’t keen on keeping under-performers around, either. The idea that you can bluff your way into a FAANG job by memorizing enough LeetCode problems yet by somehow rem…

Ok, I'll bite, please tell me what makes your average FAANG hire so much better than the rest.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#503

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The $500K developer trope is getting out of control. The truth is that there are a small number of companies in a small number of locations paying those high salaries to a small number of highly talented developers. Once you enter that bubble it can feel like everyone around you is earning the same amount and therefore you can’t understand why everyone else in the US isn’t doing the exact same thing. In reality, the…

"there are a small number of companies in a small number of locations paying those high salaries to a small number of highly talented developers" Are they really that talented, or are they just good at whiteboarding algorithm questions that they almost never actually use on the job?

A PhD and being good at whiteboarding (I've started algorithmic challenges at around 10yo) got me a L3 job. Which levels.fyi values at a total of $190k, but in my location was actually around €100k. Anything above that, you have to show something more valuable than coding on a napkin.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#504
post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As opposed to Wikipedia where the content is written by third parties, and Wikimedia largely focuses (or should focus) on hosting the resulting content?

How often is archived pages edited? It is a very different problem hosting static and dynamic data.

An "archive" is a repository of material that can't be edited. Editing archives is a kind of fraud.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#505
post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You find it disgusting that a service, which you probably use both directly and indirectly multiple times a day and costs you nothing, has the nerve to give you a suggestion of donating 10$ once? That is a very peculiar attitude to have.

I find this attitude peculiar. The editors who provided all that value will get $0. It's like buying an album where $9.92 goes to the label and yet the label still complains about freeloaders depriving the poor musicians of income if they don't pay the $10.

You are comparing apples and oranges there.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#506
post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who worked in a sandwich shop to survive while going to college($7.5/hr, 30 hrs/week), I can't imagine the universe some people live in where an income of $375,000 doesn't seem sky high. It's like there is a section of people who live in a different world. I understand that it isn't much for an executive, but then that stuns me even more. Edit: median US salary is around $70k. This executive's pay is over…

> Those who say it's not a lot are disconnected from the way that most people in the country and the world live. I live in Canada. I earn much less than USD $375K/yr. But can we agree that I am very connected with how people live in other parts of the world? Good. Now let me tell you that were my employer to ask me to move my family to the US, ANYWHERE in the US, I would want way more than $375,000/yr to duplicate th…

What if I was laid off and lost my benefits right when she was diagnosed

She'd go on Medicaid. Anyway, quit watching so much TV. It's just propaganda.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#507

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What exactly is that CEO doing for that money? What important strategic decisions are there to make at Wikipedia? Why do they have to be San Francisco based? The annual real median personal income in the US in 2019 was $35,977[0], how can anyone think that $120k isn't a lot? Why should people around the world donate their hard earned money so that some employees in America can have Silicon Valley salaries? [0] https:…

This is insane - are you arguing the Wikipedia should hire cheaper developers because they are a non-profit? Why stop there - why shouldn't Wikipedia fully cut corners and hire a body shop in a 3rd world country to build the site that millions of people use. wikipedia SHOULD be paying competitve salaries so that their best and brightest don't leave to join tire-fire companies like Facebook. I don't know why you think…

> are you arguing the Wikipedia should hire cheaper developers because they are a non-profit?

> You are disparaging a CEO for making 350k/year for one of the highest trafficked sites in the world

The root of the question is: what determines compensation at companies? FAANG and SV startups are able to offer huge salaries not because they are "the highest trafficked sites in the world". It's because they rake in billions of dollars in revenue, by monetizing their users, and/or because they are VC-funded. If that wasn't the case, their employees' -- and certainly their executives' -- salaries would not be this high.

When your company makes billions of dollars a year, and you can make the case to your board that you can increase or maintain that number, that's when your salary becomes high -- when the tradeoff to shareholder value between paying you a lot of money and the company making a lot of money tips your way. You don't just automatically get a high salary for running (or working in) a large company, if that company does not make this much money.

The WMF is a nonprofit. It does not make any money aside from donations. When running its donation campaigns, it does so from the perspective of keeping internet knowledge alive, rather than saying "we think it's important to keep ourselves in the top 10% worldwide salary bracket". It's absoluetly fair to say that they need to raise a certain amount of money in order to keep the foundation going, and in order to maintain and develop it. But saying that it's "insane" to argue that a nonprofit should not be able to compete against a multi-billion dollar organization salary-wise is... strange?

Most of the world's companies, startups or otherwise, in fact can't afford SV salaries, and so they look elsewhere -- there are many, many great developers, executives, and other folks around the world (and in the US, outside of SV) who work for less than FAANG salaries. This doesn't meant they aren't well-compensated, it just means that maybe they don't live in SV, and that yes, it's possible that FAANG will poach some of them. That's just something you have to live with when you don't make infinite amounts of money, like 99% of the world's companies.

> For perspective, Zuckerberg's net worth places him at an effective salary of 3B/year ...

For perspective, Facebook's revenue was about $85B last year. Using the world's fifth-richest person, who heads a fortune 150 company that is the F in the only five-lettered FAANG acronym that's frequently used as the barometer for high salaries, "for perspective", is also strange. The only perspective that Zuckerberg's salary offers is "what does the top 0.1% of the top 0.1% make?"

> it's your kind of attitude (why should a burger flipper get paid $15/hr) that is actually suppressing wages in this country

It's disingenuous at best to connect a nonprofit's executive staff making large salaries with raising the minimum wage. In fact, that's precisely the discrepancy that is making folks talk about the salaries at WMF: the foundation is soliciting donations from the folks making $15/h in order to pay its CEO $300k+ a year.

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#508
post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hold on there, cowboy. 100k was maybe "sky high" 20 years ago. 100k in most large cities is not. When your modest house costs $800k USD, a car costs 30k, auto insurance is $1600 a year, groceries are 10k a year (looking at you, Toronto), just how in the hell is 100k "sky high"? $80k was a decent salary in a mid-size city 15 years ago. Just because six figures seems like a lot of money to you doesn't mean it's a lot o…

These people could work from anywhere.. especially today that working remote has become the norm, but even if working remote wasn't an option there's no reason they have to live in an expensive city. They could commute, just like most of the rest of us who can't afford to live in rich cities. Wikimedia is a global foundation, so they don't have to live in the US even. They could have easily hired someone from a count…

Brilliant idea: cut those costs 10x by moving the staff to Belarus. What can possibly go wrong?

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#509

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chief of Community Engagement Chief Community Officer Chief Talent and Culture Officer Chargée d'affaires Chief Global Development Officer Chief Creative Officer Chief Communications Officer Chief Revenue Officer VP of Strategic Partnerships 55 million USD in annual salary expenses seems a bit high, even more so for a non-profit. I have seen startup unicorns spend less on salaries. I think there really needs to be so…

Much of this stuff is needed in some form. It's the kind of things that random Internet volunteers don't do well. And with the unique opportunity that Wikimedia has of establishing the broader free-knowledge and free-content movement as a leading force in global education, I think we should be happy that significant resources are being used to pursue this strategic goal.

Except they aren't, and a large number of Wikipedia articles ard so wrong, biased, and locked out from being edited by power hungry mods that its academic merit is questionable

Re: Wikipedia is swimming in money–why is it begging people to donate?

#510
post #75

> But keeping Wikipedia online is a task that the WMF could comfortably manage on $10 million a year This part is disingenuous and bordering on malicious. The linked email ( https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2013-March... ) has so much more nuance, and in typical fashion a single number from it is taken completely out of context to push a certain narrative. It is also an estimate from almost a decade…

Note this part: > 43% Direct support to communities > The Wikimedia projects exist thanks to volunteer communities around the world that create and maintain them. We strengthen these communities through grants, programs, events, trainings, partnerships, tools to augment contributor capacity, and support for the legal defense of editors. My wife's friend just came to stay with us. He worked for the Wikimedia foundatio…

Wikipedia doesn't need an engineering team that is "the best basketball team in the world". They don't need to invent Wikimedia; it's already been invented. WM is a maintenance job.

There are thousands of editors who deal with vandalism. WM doesn't need to develop new vandalism-detection software.

Post reply on HN