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It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

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Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#881

Post by knorker »

skinnymuch wrote: post #742
mthoms wrote: post #623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a good comparison insofar as the tools were/are primitive and only usable by experts. A lot of domain knowledge was required. You can hate crypto and still agree with me on the above point. It's a pretty innocuous observation. I'm not going to engage the rest of your argument which has no bearing on the point being made.

Yeah! My brother was an expert in 1990 at 6. Me at 6 in 93-94. Except we most certainly weren’t. You’re giving a completely wrong impression of how the early web was and the early internet. I wasn’t around for that so I won’t personally give my input but for the time, each iteration every few years was great. If domain knowledge wasn’t needed by the 90s. When was serious domain knowledge needed? When did that stop? S…

I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

Comparing cryptocurrencies to the Internet is about comparing its usefulness, not it's understandability. I won't argue that people in general understood the Internet.

Take my example of Fidonet. If you were not a computer expert then you had never heard of Fidonet. BBSs? Maybe you'd heard of it in some news clip about the dangers of computers.

Hell, the only time non-experts even saw anything close to a BBS was probably the movie Wargames.

> You’re giving a completely wrong impression of how the early web was and the early internet.

In what way?

> I wasn’t around for that so I won’t personally give my input

You don't know, but you know I'm wrong about it?

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#882

Post by tetherino »

nostrademons wrote: post #855
pavlov wrote: post #21

“But it’s like the early Internet!” shouted the Emperor’s coinholders. “The Internet wasn’t yet useful a mere, um, thirteen years after its invention either.” I can see how people in their twenties would fall for this argument because they can’t remember. The reality is that the internet was immediately extremely interesting (either useful or fun) for practically everyone who got access. Email and ftp alone were kill…

If you date the Internet from development of ARPANET in 1969, it really wasn't useful for 13 years after its development. For one, the general public couldn't get on it. Two, the early Internet basically consisted of running a packet-switched network on top of the existing circuit-switched phone network, at drastically reduced efficiency. That was the only other network that existed, after all. Three, DNS didn't exis…

Official start of internet is 1983.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#883

Post by imtringued »

kragen wrote: post #751
NamTaf wrote: post #630

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s the long date concept, promoted by the Long Now foundation [1] which promotes long-term thinking and gives a nod to this by writing years in 5-digit format. The irony with the GP’s post is that I can’t see using Bitcoin, with its current incredibly-high power usage and associated environmental destruction, as long-term thinking in any way, shape or form. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Now_Foundation

Bitcoin doesn't have associated environmental destruction right now that I know of. I assume you're referring to its energy consumption, but at the moment it's a subsidy to renewable energy, because nuclear energy and fossil fuels (except for flare gas) are too expensive to compete with super-cheap wind, geothermal, hydroelectric, and photovoltaic energy. https://hbr.org/2021/05/how-much-energy-does-bitcoin-actuall..…

There are cases of Bitcoin mines stealing electricity and fossil fuel powerplants being retrofitted for Bitcoin mining there is no way miners care about the source of their energy.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#884

Post by imtringued »

K0balt wrote: post #735
pavlov wrote: post #21

“But it’s like the early Internet!” shouted the Emperor’s coinholders. “The Internet wasn’t yet useful a mere, um, thirteen years after its invention either.” I can see how people in their twenties would fall for this argument because they can’t remember. The reality is that the internet was immediately extremely interesting (either useful or fun) for practically everyone who got access. Email and ftp alone were kill…

Hmm. It’s interesting to note that skeptics seem much more invested in being right about crypto being a scam than proponents are in it being here to stay. The more time passes, the shriller the cries of skeptics become, leading me to believe that skeptics are emotionally invested to the extreme in the failure of crypto. I rarely see any carefully considered, informed opinions just tulips and drugs and money launderin…

As a Bitcoin skeptic: I'll take my shitcoin money (or lose it) and that's all there is to it.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#885

Post by miracle2k »

doom wrote: post #850
lhl wrote: post #764

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To answer your last question first, crypto clearly is a superior platform for finance, exactly because of the explosion in "self-referential shell games" - it's in fact an extreme democratizer of "finance" - anyone can create their own liquidity pools, it's trivial to create not just CDOs, but CDO2s, 3s 4s, and they all run 24/7 forever. (no, this does not have much relevance to "real" economic activity, but this is…

Can you explain why I need a crypto(tm) Gitcoin and not just a cyber chuck e cheese token? I give cyber-chuck $1 and he gives me 1 cyber token. I can subdivide it 10,000 times and micro-tip any site I want. Why do I need cryptocurrency? If your argument is that crypto would decentralize it, and guarantee a cap on coin totals, I don't buy it. That's not the reason a site owner wouldn't join a coin plan. "I would love…

Yes, don't get hung up on a cap on coins. That's optional.

You could issue those tokens in a centralized way, but with Ethereum, a 1000 such tokens can interact.

The question is rather, if you wanted to do a cyber chuck e cheese, why wouldn't you do it on a (performant) blockchain?

If the question is why do we need all those tokens for, and this is a good perspective on it:

https://insights.deribit.com/market-research/why-i-have-chan...

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#886

Post by imtringued »

ergot_vacation wrote: post #792
K0balt wrote: post #735

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm. It’s interesting to note that skeptics seem much more invested in being right about crypto being a scam than proponents are in it being here to stay. The more time passes, the shriller the cries of skeptics become, leading me to believe that skeptics are emotionally invested to the extreme in the failure of crypto. I rarely see any carefully considered, informed opinions just tulips and drugs and money launderin…

They really have cranked up the propaganda against crypto recently haven't they? I've honestly been lukewarm on it for a while: maybe someday it'll be a workable tech, but too many issues at present. But the way these people talk (or are being paid to talk), you'd think Bitcoin breathed fire and had horns. Which begs the question: what are they afraid of? And they ARE afraid of something. You don't launch a propagand…

Yes I am afraid, I am afraid that I won't be able to acquire some real estate properties to rent them out at reasonable prices. This literally has nothing to do with Bitcoin.

Oh, I am also worried about not completing that robotics project I started, because I don't have enough time.

Thanks for your comment.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#887

Post by imtringued »

roca wrote: post #784
K0balt wrote: post #735

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm. It’s interesting to note that skeptics seem much more invested in being right about crypto being a scam than proponents are in it being here to stay. The more time passes, the shriller the cries of skeptics become, leading me to believe that skeptics are emotionally invested to the extreme in the failure of crypto. I rarely see any carefully considered, informed opinions just tulips and drugs and money launderin…

Every time a Musk tweet swings the value of BTC by 20% --- in either direction --- Bitcoin loses credibility as a store of value. "Price greater than zero" is not enough to make something a good store of value. BTC as a means of payment is a joke. Most Bitcoin fans I engage with have actually given up on that. In fact, the scaling limitations of Bitcoin transactions are now touted as a good thing because that bounds…

The store of value concept makes no sense because such a thing cannot exist. When you buy Bitcoin you hope the seller does something that maintains the existence of an economy that exchanges their currency for Bitcoin.

You can't just pile up gold and then expect to get something for it if everyone else is dead. You need a group of people (aka economy) willing to work for the gold.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#888

Post by [deleted] »

eli wrote: post #513
acjohnson55 wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% this. It's the world's greatest machine for generating motivated reasoning. People buy in during the pump and get incredibly motivated to join the immune system for their chosen coin.

I spent a long time giving NFTs the benefit of the doubt because I didn’t really get it and I couldn’t get anyone to explain it to me who wasn’t also VERY invested in their outcome and unable to concede the possibility of any downsides.

[deleted]

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#889

Post by imtringued »

chrisco255 wrote: post #93
pavlov wrote: post #21

“But it’s like the early Internet!” shouted the Emperor’s coinholders. “The Internet wasn’t yet useful a mere, um, thirteen years after its invention either.” I can see how people in their twenties would fall for this argument because they can’t remember. The reality is that the internet was immediately extremely interesting (either useful or fun) for practically everyone who got access. Email and ftp alone were kill…

Have you been looking at the Maetaverse at all? https://www.sandbox.game/en/ https://decentraland.org/ These are 3D virtual world environments and people are using crypto to build an online economy. They are trading property, buying virtual artwork and creating galleries, setting up clubs and meeting spaces, etc. You can also explore decentralized finance, act as a peer-to-peer lender, provide liquidity in a marketpl…

The games may be bad (I don't know) but honestly at least the currency is being used for something. I personally disagree with in app purchases because it leads to game design where the cash shop becomes the solution to all the pre designed problems but criticizing game design isn't the same thing as criticizing cryptocurrencies.

Re: It's time for us in the tech world to speak out about cryptocurrency

#890

Post by timdaub »

mandelken wrote: post #536
skybrian wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are $2 ATM fees "stealing?" They provide a service, which you can pay for or easily avoid by planning ahead a bit. (And cryptocurrency charges even more.)

Depends on your background and experience, I guess. In many European countries ATMs are free, even outside your own country. It is considered an elementary part of the banking service that you don't have to pay to withdraw your own money.

This is not true. Most quickly accessible ATMs in e.g. Berlin charge a fee. I spent €€€ on ATM withdrawals yearly.
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