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Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

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Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#351

Post by ashtonkem »

nebulous1 wrote: post #347
ageitgey wrote: post #215

Like most people, I've ordered a lot of packages (hundreds?) on Amazon and almost never had a problem. In the rare case of a problem, Amazon would instantly refund me. But almost all those orders are under $1000. Everything changes when you have a problem with an expensive order. Amazon has a price threshold where the support system is different and the normal CS people are powerless. During lockdown, I ordered a Son…

I dislike buying from Amazon and I don't doubt you had a frustrating experience here. That said, how would you have expected this to go? I assume everybody is in agreement that this wasn't going to be sorted out the next day. I think you might be overestimating how smoothly this would go when dealing with another company, although obviously there would be exceptions to that.

Honestly, I would expect it to be sorted quickly and by one person. If I’m paying thousands of dollars for a high end product, especially with a company I’ve (presumably) spent tens of thousands of dollars with, I expect to be taken care of when something goes wrong.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#352

Post by nigerian1981 »

rkalla wrote: post #315
nigerian1981 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve found my credit card company, American Express to be great for getting refunds in cases like this and always use my credit card for larger purchases.

Like others have said - be careful with this option - there are a LOT Of examples in the Google Fi forums about people doing a chargeback with Google because of charges they felt were fair or fraudulent via Google Fi, and next thing they know their Google Account (Photos, Docs, Email, etc.) is disabled. I would watch the same thing with Amazon (Music, Alexa, Photos, AWS, etc.)

That’s a good point. I hadn’t really considered that.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#353

Post by menzoic »

rkalla wrote: post #315
nigerian1981 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve found my credit card company, American Express to be great for getting refunds in cases like this and always use my credit card for larger purchases.

Like others have said - be careful with this option - there are a LOT Of examples in the Google Fi forums about people doing a chargeback with Google because of charges they felt were fair or fraudulent via Google Fi, and next thing they know their Google Account (Photos, Docs, Email, etc.) is disabled. I would watch the same thing with Amazon (Music, Alexa, Photos, AWS, etc.)

Backup everything elsewhere regularly https://zapier.com/apps/dropbox/integrations/google-drive

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#354

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

onli wrote: post #202
mft_ wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if there are regions (or countries) which are worse? Amazon in Germany is also great, so far. I’m like you - I’ve ordered so many things from Amazon this last year or so (new circumstances plus pandemic lockdown) and literally not one problem of the sort described. I can think of two items out of hundreds which weren’t on time (one, Amazons’s logistics made it a whole day late, and one was the seller’s issue…

Amazon in Germany can also go very wrong. This is why I stopped ordering there: I ordered a bunch of small electronics stuff, about 100€. In the order process Amazon selected an expired credit card (which I'm sure I had replaced in the settings already). They then split the order in parts and for each order part demanded an additional late pay fee, because the card was expired. This is despite me calling them to stop…

Fulfilled by Amazon.de screwed up my last micro-order. I ordered an 8-pack of something and got a 5-pack.

Trivial for small items, but doesn't bode well for high value orders.

It's a confidence issue. Amazon has become a logistics giant but is steadily losing customer confidence.

A combination of fake reviews, fake items, high-friction or just plain missing consumer support on high-value items, and a hopelessly confused mess of a shop front all add up to a mediocre and untrustworthy experience.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#355

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

onli wrote: post #233
inapis wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would an order go through with an expired credit card? Is this something like cash-on-delivery or card-on-delivery?

Valid question. I was switching bank accounts at that time, so it's possible the card was not expired but linked to an account that did not exist anymore. Might also have been the account itself and not the card that was listed (Lastschriftverfahren, where they take money directly from the account). I'm fuzzy about the details, not really because it was particularly long ago (~2 years), but because it was confusing b…

This has happened to me. In some circumstances banks will still honour a charge even though the card is expired.

You'll have to ask the banks why. In my case it wasn't a problem, but technically it shouldn't happen and it's strange that it did.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#356

Post by jurassic »

massysett wrote: post #209
amelius wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to agree with damaged books. It seems Amazon is using lower quality packaging material today than they did a few years ago.

What’s changed is that they don’t care about packaging books anymore. Previously they would ship books inside of an airgap in a box, or at least inside of a tight box that would prevent damage. Now they will just throw it into a Mylar envelope that offers no protection against bending.

Agreed. Bubble envelopes can work okay if they are the correct size, but I often get normal-sized books shipped to me in XXXL size Amazon envelopes. These mailer envelopes are big enough for the book to rotate freely in amy direction inside of the packaging. So it’s inevitable that it arrives with creased or torn pages and jacket. I even had one where the cover separated from the pages. Horrible.

My preferred approach now is to use niche-retailers for things I care about arriving intact on the assumption that if your entire business is about that product category then you should be knowledgeable about how to ship those items safely. Barnes & Noble for books, B&H for camera, BestBuy for consumer electronics and video games, etc.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#357

Post by gambiting »

vt100 wrote: post #280
dagaci wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here, i have been ordering with Amazon (Uk & occationally Us) for 21 years and can count on 1 hand the number the number of times i've had delivery issues. ALL other delivery outfits are horrible in comparison, and i actually dred using any other service.

The UK has many horrible delivery services. DPD and Amazon are two that are acceptable. I dread trying to receive a delivery from any other service. Incredibly there are more than a few that are actually worse than Royal Mail.

UPS is 100% solid for me too. Been shipping with them within the UK and I know they can be trusted. DPD provides much better delivery tracking though, not only they provide an accurate 1 hour slot, they also take a picture of the parcel being delivered so there's no doubt where it went.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#358

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

fennecfoxen wrote: post #284
heavyset_go wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems if customers report fakes, customers who potentially also received fakes are not alerted and that is a real problem for me. Amazon doesn't even bother to collect that data. If you want to make a return because you received a counterfeit, you need to lie about the reason for your return, because "I received/believe I received a counterfeit product" isn't a choice they let you choose from when filing a retur…

Product Not As Described. (It was described as the actual product, not as a counterfeit.)

That doesn't distinguish between "I ordered a book and got a plant mister" and "I ordered a book and got a stapled photocopy with greasy fingerprints."

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#359

Post by dboreham »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #349
ageitgey wrote: post #215

Like most people, I've ordered a lot of packages (hundreds?) on Amazon and almost never had a problem. In the rare case of a problem, Amazon would instantly refund me. But almost all those orders are under $1000. Everything changes when you have a problem with an expensive order. Amazon has a price threshold where the support system is different and the normal CS people are powerless. During lockdown, I ordered a Son…

I don't know if all shipping companies do this but my experience with Amazon in the UK is that they track and keep records of the whereabouts of their delivery vans. Once I had an order "delivered" without trace and Amazon asked my to check with neighbours first as, according to their records, the van has stopped at my house. On another occasion I knew that the van never came despite order again listed as "delivered"…

Based on some personal experience with "lost" packages, and discussions with delivery drivers, this is also the case in the US. This makes it even more egregious when the carriers quibble because surely they know the package was stolen in transit.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#360

Post by harimau777 »

ericmay wrote: post #340
JCharante wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one problem I face with centralization. If all stores handle purchases on their own, it's fine if your local camera shop refuses you as a customer because you also probably don't want to deal with them again, but if you are forced to use your CC company to dispute against steam, amazon, google, you are risking being banned from their service. You are risking access to your photos, documents, and emails. To us…

I agree, but we are far from centralized. Very far. -edit- If you think we're centralized and you're "downvoting to disagree" at least have some decency to explain how we're centralized. There is nothing that Amazon sells that I can't buy an alternative product at a dozen other retailers for comparable prices, for example.

I think that it varies.

Due to network effects, there often aren't good alternatives for social media like Facebook or collaborative cloud tools like Google docs.

For games, it's not unusual for indy games to only release on Steam. Even when there is a physical release, that option is becoming increasingly difficult (e.g. many computers no longer have a built in disc drive, many stores no longer carry PC games, etc.).

This is less common than the previous two examples, but it may be difficult to find niche products outside of Etsy. For example, I haven't been able to find another place to purchase this specialized martial arts equipment: https://www.etsy.com/listing/175827423/

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