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ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

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Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#211

Post by mdoms »

zxzax wrote: post #138
spiderice wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re replies are very frustrating. It’s like you’re completely missing the point of the replies and focusing on very tiny, irrelevant details. Nobody is claiming that you can’t remove deactivated accounts. Only that you charge for them until you go through the rather annoying process of contacting customer support. And then you make some bad excuse that it’s in the name of security because somebody could potentiall…

This seems to be assuming bad faith, you've changed a complaint of a missing feature into a different request for a new feature (because contacting support is inconvenient), which are two different things. It would be best to not confuse the issue, and to focus on doing what you can to support the feature request, if that's what you're interested in having.

I don't know how anyone could look at protonmail's responses and not assume bad faith. They're obfuscating the issue so they can make technically correct but effectively useless excuses for crappy behaviour.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#212

Post by Dylan16807 »

texasbigdata wrote: post #142
alpaca128 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Full-text search within the average amount of a single user's emails is trivial and fast on any modern PC. Smartphones do it for autocompletion suggestions every time you type a letter. The only thing taking longer than a few milliseconds is the initial indexing.

This sort of comment is frustrating. How many times has XYZ site had broken search? It seems to _not_ be a trivial problem still.

> This sort of comment is frustrating. How many times has XYZ site had broken search?

I can't even think of any? But also search isn't a core feature for the vast majority of sites. Something can be easy and still break if nobody cares very much.

Edit: Actually I can think of search breaking on one site that was notoriously badly run and had 0 to 1 part-time devs. That's not a flattering comparison.

Edit 2: So could the people that disagree name some notable sites with broken search? I feel like if I don't understand what "XYZ" stands for it's probably not something I should be blamed for...

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#213

Post by jjav »

rantwasp wrote: post #87
edoceo wrote: post #82

Another user-hostile. Folks laugh when I say I run my own email (FreeBSD/Postfix) and "why build your own mail client"? Because, inevitably, all these for profit service providers turn against me.

i would not laugh. think it’s impressive and must eat a lot of time

> i would not laugh. think it’s impressive and must eat a lot of time

It does not.

I set up my latest/current email hosting in about 2011. Very minimal work on it since then. There's really nothing to do once it's working.

Only work I can think of I've spent on it since 2011 is: regular OS updates (which take basically no time), added SPF and later DKIM support, added Let's Encrypt cert. That's it in ten years.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#214

Post by takeda »

gerash wrote: post #209
protonmail wrote: post #79

A few comments about this. A very small fraction of logins get the CAPTCHA challenge. We, and other services, face unrelenting brute force attacks on our login endpoints. If you are seeing a CAPTCHA on login, chances are that something about your connection is suspicious to our system. It's far from perfect, and we continue to improve it, but at most a percent or two of users are seeing CAPTCHA at any time. The CAPTC…

What's the problem with using ReCAPTCHA? Is it not the best tool for the job?

Protonmail goal is to preserve privacy, while Google's goal is to collect your private data.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#215

Post by Rastonbury »

jjav wrote: post #201
protonmail wrote: post #79

A few comments about this. A very small fraction of logins get the CAPTCHA challenge. We, and other services, face unrelenting brute force attacks on our login endpoints. If you are seeing a CAPTCHA on login, chances are that something about your connection is suspicious to our system. It's far from perfect, and we continue to improve it, but at most a percent or two of users are seeing CAPTCHA at any time. The CAPTC…

A captcha of any kind on a paid service (or a storefront where I'm looking to pay money) is an absolute deal breaker for me. I will not be clicking on lights and stopsigns to be able to pay money.

Looks like they feel it's a necessary evil and only hits 1-2 percent of users

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#216

Post by sygma »

dang wrote: post #199
AsianTits wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can try https://www.hcaptcha.com as an alternative.

You can't use that sort of username on HN—see https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme... . I've banned the account for now, but if you want to use it with a different name, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and we'll get you fixed up. (btw, the GP mentions hcaptcha)

Not questioning this dang, but would be useful to add something about trollish usernames in the guidelines, and perhaps clarify what qualifies as trollish.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#217

Post by gerash »

takeda wrote: post #214
gerash wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the problem with using ReCAPTCHA? Is it not the best tool for the job?

Protonmail goal is to preserve privacy, while Google's goal is to collect your private data.

Please be more concrete. What exactly is the risk here? That Google can look into the logs and infer a Mac OS Bigsur with Chrome v90 is logging into proton mail today at x:xx pm?

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#218

Post by intricatedetail »

rantwasp wrote: post #106
inamiyar wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with running my own email is I don't want the hassle of convincing Google I'm not spam.

gonna replace and evil with another one, but you can use amazon workmail (they have the spf, dkim, dmarc stuff figured out) with your own domain. it takes 10 minutes to setup. it does not have a flashy web ui - but if you do imap it doesn’t matter. cost: 12$/year for the domain, 4$/month for the user, 0.5$/month for the route53 zone so 5.5$/month to kick gmail to the curb. the gov is still gonna get your emails if th…

But does it mean Amazon reads your email?

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#219

Post by abdullahkhalids »

gerash wrote: post #217
takeda wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protonmail goal is to preserve privacy, while Google's goal is to collect your private data.

Please be more concrete. What exactly is the risk here? That Google can look into the logs and infer a Mac OS Bigsur with Chrome v90 is logging into proton mail today at x:xx pm?

Google is discovering that this particular user is ripe for advertising security related products.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#220

Post by celsoazevedo »

Hard_Space wrote: post #85
protonmail wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Luminati, and companies like that, distribute an SDK to many app developers. App developers incorporate the SDK, and your device is unwittingly turned into a proxy network endpoint, and the app developer gets paid for this. A surprising number of apps do this, so you could have an app installed doing this without even being aware, as it would only be disclosed in the app's privacy policy, which people don't actually…

Perhaps a list of apps would be helpful, otherwise it seems kind of a vague deflection.

That's not something ProtonMail can provide you with. It's like asking them to list you all apps that use the Facebook SDK or something like that.

What was described above is correct though. One popular app (which had legal troubles recently) made money with Luminati:

https://torrentfreak.com/mobdro-luminati-proxy-service-suspe...

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