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ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

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Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#21

Try to register a new Protonmail email address normally and you can do so without supplying too much information. Try to do so through Tor, and you will not be able to proceed without “verifying” the account with a phone number. This pattern (they want either your IP or a phone number) tells me they’re likely interested in tying accounts to real identities and shouldn’t be trusted with anything private. I would even…

Yep noticed this a long time ago and am very suspicious

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#22

I can recommend Migadu. Worth it if you already pay for a domain (which you should, imo, to have a portable e-mail address). I pay for the $19 annual plan and find it sufficient, and I love the flexibility of the admin panel.

+1 for Migadu! I'd been a paying customer for Protonmail for a few years now but stuff like this had slowly been pushing me away. A few months ago I set up Migadu with my own domain and it's worked without issue ever since. Another plus is that I can finally use my own email clients without having to deal with proton bridge

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#23
post #5

That stinks. I'm on Fastmail but its hard point has to do with being based in Australia and the recent government efforts of forcing entities to comply with police inquiries. Fastmail's side of the story: https://fastmail.blog/legal-policy/aabill-and-fastmail/

Fastmail rightly points out that the Australian law has no meaningful impact on them. They do not offer an end-to-end encrypted service, and hence, don't need to backdoor it. The vast majority of mail services will hand your data to the government on court order. Though if your mail is hosted in a different country than you live in, it's arguably more frustrating for them to do so, since they must use international a…

>it's arguably more frustrating for them to do so, since they must use international agreements to get it. //

Caution, abject speculation:

I thought spooks like this kind of thing because they can do illegal things in other jurisdictions that they're restrained from doing in their own - or get foreign agents to spy on you to avoid getting a warrant. Like they can route traffic to another country, then have affects there hack you to avoid laws that curtail actions against your own citizens.

I don't know, just seemed like one point of groups like Five-eyes.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#24

I was scratching my head this week when they were releasing the time the 'Hamas' bomb threat email came in with regard to Belarus high-jacking that flight. It seemed rather fine-grained knowledge of specific communications that doesn't serve the narrative of privacy first. The articles I read made it sound like ProtonMail had just decided to share details on it rather than a more formal, court-ordered process. I know…

I understand what you mean, but it's important to understand the technological side here. Protonmail offers an email service, and despite all privacy marketing, very little of that applies to emails which enters or leave their own systems. This is a requirement if their users are to communicate with a non-Protonmail address.

Any message that interface with the standard email network is better off regarded as public communication. I can only imagine the legal implications that would compel Protonmail to assist law enforcement after their Service was misused and complicit in an alleged bomb threat.

Their Terms of Service surely outline that illegal activity will void their protection as far as possible. Keeping communications inside their in-house, zero-knowledge email service on the other hand, would make it very hard for Protonmail to produce any of this information. That is their actual privacy offer, as far as I understand.

To Protonmails defense, I haven't heard that this email has successfully been linked to any real identity past the phony Sulanov alias.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#25

Try to register a new Protonmail email address normally and you can do so without supplying too much information. Try to do so through Tor, and you will not be able to proceed without “verifying” the account with a phone number. This pattern (they want either your IP or a phone number) tells me they’re likely interested in tying accounts to real identities and shouldn’t be trusted with anything private. I would even…

I'm not saying you're wrong, but that particular source is well known for making big claims with insufficient evidence, and it reads like it was written by a conspiracy theorist. Many of the author's claims have already been (imo, pretty solidly) refuted by Proton.

Disclaimer: using protonmail until my current subscription runs out, then selfhosting

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#26

Try to register a new Protonmail email address normally and you can do so without supplying too much information. Try to do so through Tor, and you will not be able to proceed without “verifying” the account with a phone number. This pattern (they want either your IP or a phone number) tells me they’re likely interested in tying accounts to real identities and shouldn’t be trusted with anything private. I would even…

I'm not saying you're wrong, but that particular source is well known for making big claims with insufficient evidence, and it reads like it was written by a conspiracy theorist. Many of the author's claims have already been (imo, pretty solidly) refuted by Proton. Disclaimer: using protonmail until my current subscription runs out, then selfhosting

Doesn’t self-hosting also have privacy downsides, being that all the hardware is tied to you? I’d imagine whatever minor resistance to wiretapping a multiuser site gave regarding privacy of non-investigated individuals would disappear.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#27

I just tried logging into Protonmail in my regular browser and with a private mode window and didn't get a captcha in either case. Not saying it may not appear for others but I didn't see it.

Modern google captcha (v3??) doesn't show a captcha if they already have enough data about you. E.g. through 3rd party cookies, or by fingerprinting anything from your browser to your mouse movement and typing pattern. (Not sure what exactly they currently use, so this are just examples of what they might use).

Ok now I'm kinda relieved that I still see reCAPTCHA so much... Locked down Firefox user here.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#28

Try to register a new Protonmail email address normally and you can do so without supplying too much information. Try to do so through Tor, and you will not be able to proceed without “verifying” the account with a phone number. This pattern (they want either your IP or a phone number) tells me they’re likely interested in tying accounts to real identities and shouldn’t be trusted with anything private. I would even…

Yep noticed this a long time ago and am very suspicious

A visitor from TOR is extraordinarily more likely to be abusive. It makes total sense to put up extra barriers, which is still short of blocking TOR users altogether, which is also fair for webmasters who don't want to deal with it.

Re: ProtonMail includes Google Recaptcha for login

#29
post #14

Also seems particularly odd to even have recaptcha on the email login page. Who cares if robots check email so it doesn’t seem user friendly to prove humanity to read email or get a login error.

robots use email systems so they can get "free" way to send their stuff. I also work for e-mail company and this is very big problem to us. Sadly recaptcha before and cloudflare captcha now are one of the irreplaceable tools to fight with spammers for us...

sadly recaptcha and cloudflare captcha will never recognize my input as correct, and i hope this is happening to a lot of people in conjunction with a trend of declining traffic as a result of using captchas
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