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The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

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Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#101

Post by ectopod »

ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

> but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance?

We didn't. This is something that has changed in the UK in my lifetime. Unless you were the subject of an investigation you didn't have to provide much detail to the tax authorities, and what you did provide was kept strictly separate from other areas of government.

There was an attempt to strike a balance with the emphasis on privacy. Nowadays the government thinks it is entitled to all the data all the time.

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#102

Post by RcrdBrt »

ip26 wrote: post #62
exo762 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can use cryptocurrency which hides all of your transactions (like zcash) and pay your taxes as a law abiding citizen. There is no conflict here. Tax systems rely on citizens reporting anyway.

Tax systems follow a “trust but verify” model.

Some are even "assume bad faith and verify"

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#103

Post by psychlops »

kd913 wrote: post #48
ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

Data can be stored, transparent but open for legitimate purposes. I don't think it's a good idea to go to the other extreme for complete anonymity in a case like this whether the consequences result in massive criminal activities. E.G. I trust my medical data to my doctor with some reasonable confidence they are using it responsibly. Same thing here, I can trust my financial institutions with my data, but I want it t…

I prefer the innocent until proven guilty model.

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#104

Post by camgunz »

ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

I think in the US, it's a war on drugs thing--though it could also be a Cold War thing. Just musing though, but yeah it's wild that we don't think this is a right.

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#106

Post by jackfoxy »

ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

> how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance?

It was very easy. The American public was hoodwinked into accepting the 16th Amendment (levying an income tax) as a tax the rich scheme. And like all tax the rich schemes it was a cover to tax everyone, especially the middle class. You can't have an income tax without the government prying into everyone's finances.

Before this financial privacy was the norm.

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#107

Post by mgerullis »

Taek wrote: post #50
alcio wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, you can email it to your miner buddy. it's possible to spot such transactions if they violate transaction forwarding rules (aka standardness rules) but not consensus rules. for example, a transaction greater than 100kB is not standard but still valid.

Law enforcement watches the mempool, they can spot such transactions anyway because they know it didn't ever show up in their mempool logs.

Ok but is it really illegal? I doubt there’s a law on who can send who private BTC transactions? Or is it actually possible to mark this as laundering?

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#108

Post by mgerullis »

alcio wrote: post #29
mgerullis wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it possible to send out transactions without sending them to the mempool?

yes, you can email it to your miner buddy. it's possible to spot such transactions if they violate transaction forwarding rules (aka standardness rules) but not consensus rules. for example, a transaction greater than 100kB is not standard but still valid.

Yeah but wouldn’t it require some kind of fork of the BTC software (not chain) to actually include this transaction without sending it to everyone else?

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#109

Post by rusabd »

auntienomen wrote: post #26
ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

If you don't interfere with money laundering, the criminals eventually acquire enormous wealth, and with it power. They eventually acquire enough power to take over the government. At that point, you're at their mercy, and theorizing about privacy laws becomes a bit pointless.

So you are saying that before money laundering laws those criminals took over the government. It is almost like said criminals just don't want any competition now

Re: The rise of crypto laundries: how criminals cash out of Bitcoin

#110

Post by crispyambulance »

auntienomen wrote: post #26
ccity88 wrote: post #14

I get that money laundering is always linked to criminal activity, but how have we always just accepted the lack of personal privacy when it comes to finance? Privacy is a feature, not a bug; and whilst crypto may not be the way forward, I hope one day we can reach a solution that has both privacy and also safety. The language used by law enforcement is quite alarming, it suggests that they should be privy to ALL tra…

If you don't interfere with money laundering, the criminals eventually acquire enormous wealth, and with it power. They eventually acquire enough power to take over the government. At that point, you're at their mercy, and theorizing about privacy laws becomes a bit pointless.

> eventually acquire enough power to take over the government

I wonder, recalling the Panama Papers incident, if this has effectively happened already!

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