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Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#131

Post by thinkmassive »

why_only_15 wrote: post #62
josefresco wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profitability calculators typically rely on the current market rate of BTC. Even if they paid for electricity, they could make up for it by keeping their earnings in BTC/whatever. Whether that's a smart decision is another issue, but for some mining is like a startup in that you burn cash early in hopes of a big exit down the road. Edit: Several people have pointed out that you can just buy BTC or crypto directly. Be…

If you have to pay $50k in electricity to mine a $40k bitcoin, it would be better to just turn off the mine and buy the bitcoin directly.

Some industrial scale miners might have commitments to buy electricity at a certain rate. It could be more expensive to break a contract than to keep their equipment running when the exchange rate temporarily falls below profitability.

Also not everyone has easy access to an exchange. Others may prefer to avoid the KYC paperwork, or simply be willing to pay a premium for freshly mined coins.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#132

Post by josefresco »

scrollaway wrote: post #60
josefresco wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profitability calculators typically rely on the current market rate of BTC. Even if they paid for electricity, they could make up for it by keeping their earnings in BTC/whatever. Whether that's a smart decision is another issue, but for some mining is like a startup in that you burn cash early in hopes of a big exit down the road. Edit: Several people have pointed out that you can just buy BTC or crypto directly. Be…

If you have cash, mining is unprofitable, and you want btc, there's a more profitable solution you're not seeing here.

> If you have cash

This is key. You can't "just buy BTC directly" if you don't have cash. Even if you have cash for the initial purchase of crypto, you then have no recurring income. The startup model is again relevant here as you're trading a short term loss, for the potential of a long term gain. Similarly, why don't VC's just invest in profitable, stable companies?

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#133

Post by josefresco »

paulcole wrote: post #66
josefresco wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profitability calculators typically rely on the current market rate of BTC. Even if they paid for electricity, they could make up for it by keeping their earnings in BTC/whatever. Whether that's a smart decision is another issue, but for some mining is like a startup in that you burn cash early in hopes of a big exit down the road. Edit: Several people have pointed out that you can just buy BTC or crypto directly. Be…

If you’re spending $1500 to mine $1000 in BTC and are bullish about the future of BTC, why not just buy $1500 of BTC?

Where do you get the $1500?

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#134

Post by 542458 »

philjohn wrote: post #13
josefresco wrote: post #10

"Detectives said they were tipped off about lots of people visiting the unit throughout the day and a police drone picked up a lot of heat coming from the building." Does that imply a drone with infrared capabilities?

Yes - they also have IR cameras on police helicopters and use this to identify likely cannabis farms fairly regularly in the UK.

They’re also useful for search&rescue as well as finding people who are trying hide in foliage, but yeah.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#135

Post by josefresco »

why_only_15 wrote: post #62
josefresco wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Profitability calculators typically rely on the current market rate of BTC. Even if they paid for electricity, they could make up for it by keeping their earnings in BTC/whatever. Whether that's a smart decision is another issue, but for some mining is like a startup in that you burn cash early in hopes of a big exit down the road. Edit: Several people have pointed out that you can just buy BTC or crypto directly. Be…

If you have to pay $50k in electricity to mine a $40k bitcoin, it would be better to just turn off the mine and buy the bitcoin directly.

This assumes you have a source of income, outside of your mining operation.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#136

Post by thinkmassive »

SamBam wrote: post #126
paulcole wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re spending $1500 to mine $1000 in BTC and are bullish about the future of BTC, why not just buy $1500 of BTC?

But surely there's some reality where only buying $1000 BTC and just setting fire to another $500 is somehow more profitable, right?

If you agree to purchase $1500/mo from the power company for 12 months, and they’re going to bill you that no matter what, then losing $500/mo (and keeping BTC that’s likely to increase in value eventually) is preferable to shutting down and losing $1500/mo.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#137

Post by swiley »

MaxBarraclough wrote: post #76
josefresco wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GPU mining is currently concentrated on ETH, which is changing (EIP 1559) mid-July (and then later this year). The GPU market will change (and already is) dramatically after that. Many are still in denial, hoping there will be "another coin" to mine. Or, they're just spreading false hope to give them time to dump their hardware.

> ETH, which is changing I don't think this is the first time I've read of a substantial change being made to a cryptocurrency. Doesn't this kind of thing completely belie the usual claim that it's free from central control? > Many are still in denial, hoping there will be "another coin" to mine. Again I don't follow this stuff that closely, but this doesn't seem absurd on the face of it. Is there a reason to think t…

This is not the first time substantial changes have been to crypto currencies (etherium or otherwise.) One recent change to bitcoin (I think the lightning network) was controversial enough to result in a fork (bitcoin cash.) There are mechanisms for this sort of thing.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#138

Post by phire »

kasey_junk wrote: post #98
phire wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That website was using a electrical rate of USD 12c per kWh, which is already on the low side. I think most electricity The break-even point is 8c per kWh. But there will be other overheads, so you probably need 6c per kWh to actually make a profit. Such prices most be possible to obtain in a few oil rich countries like Saudi Arabia and Iraq.

You can routinely get ~2 c kWh in Chicago: https://hourlypricing.comed.com/

That's not the total price.

It doesn't include Transmission, distribution, taxes or whatever a "Capacity Charge" is.

Re: Sandwell Bitcoin mine found stealing electricity

#139

Post by boringg »

You'd think the UK grid has better tech for revenue protection (Aka protection against stealing). There have been a lot of companies who specialize in doing this in the US. Its a combination of data processing and decent quality hardware on the grid.

My suspicion is they haven't done upgrades on their systems...

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