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House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

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Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#91

Post by yunohn »

Teever wrote: post #85
yunohn wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, this is not some weird fine line slippery slope situation. Normal people don’t often buy 269,000 of acres of land, only influential people like Bill Gates can.

The claim is that Bill Gates has bought too much farm land. If someone is making that claim surely they can clarify exactly what too much is and why. How do you expect anyone to take this suggestion seriously? How do you expect actual policy to be set without clearly defined boundaries of acceptable behaviour?

It’s a lot like the famous “I’ll know it when I see it” concept. Also none of us here are lawmakers…

But hey, you seem very sure of yourself. Do you think there is any amount you consider too much?

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#92

Post by imtringued »

eutropia wrote: post #87

Just your annual reminder that the Land Value Tax is the Least Evil Tax. Tax "rent"[0] at 85-100%, allow owner-residents to defer LVT taxes owed to time of sale with modest interest. Speculators would be naturally driven out in favor of people actually using the land. [0] - Which is gatekeeping/charging for land (finite natural unimproved resources like space, spectrum, water, wildlife, oil, etc)

Another way would be to simply raise capital gains taxes on land. Making money off of land (as opposed to renting) just doesn't make sense. It's basically Bitcoin with real life consequences.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#93

Post by thehappypm »

This is way more about a drop in rents than anything else, obviously. Rents are super low nationwide right now, as folks abandoned high-rent areas in the pandemic. Meanwhile the housing market is very long-term oriented, and reasonably rational.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#94

Post by lotsofpulp »

ghaff wrote: post #61
mumblemumble wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're talking the US, that law is for the benefit of the rich. In general, the interest won't exceed the standard deduction unless you've got a rather obscenely priced home.

That didn't use to be the case. The mortgage interest deduction used to be a solidly middle class benefit. But, yes, with relatively recent changes to the tax code, it's a lot harder for most people to hit the standard deduction and therefore mortgage interest is often not deductible unless someone has a higher end home in an expensive area.

The mortgage interest deduction was and is a benefit for lenders. It's sole benefit is to increase the amount one can borrow by effectively lowering the cost of borrowing.

A solidly middle class benefit would be cash given to the middle class. A benefit for existing home owners selling their homes to middle class buyers is a cash benefit given to middle class buyers. A subsidy for borrowing money is a benefit for the person lending money.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#95

Post by thehappypm »

akudha wrote: post #35

I wish something is done about these rentiers. Someone I know is amassing a rental property portfolio, while I am struggling to buy my first home. I am not against people making money and getting rich, but it would be nice if it wasn’t so easy to buy up multiple properties simply because they have the cash. There should be all kinds of incentives for first time home buyers. But it should be made very expensive/very p…

There are tons of incentives for first time home buyers! They just aren't really marketed.

You can take out a mortgage against your own 401(k) for your first home.

You can use a VERY low down payment loan (like 0% in some cases) for your first home.

Tax rates are lower in many places for homeowners than renters -- in Boston and Somerville MA, this comes out to a pretty substantial tax credit.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#96

Post by lotsofpulp »

question000 wrote: post #82
anon98356 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firstly, never and never in your lifetime are two very different timespans. Second, just because those houses from 2008 recession are now worth more than in 2008 doesn't mean they have been steadily increasing in value since 2008. There have definitely been downturns in the property market. One in particular that springs to mind is the impact of Brexit on house prices in London. Sure, eventually the price might recov…

Ok never ever have housing really prices gone down. Look at any chart of average home prices in the US if you bought a house at any time and waited 10 years you definitely made money. Even in neighborhoods where >50% people were in foreclosure their homes are worth more then ever. If you can find anywhere housing prices are less then in 2008 please say so. The Brexit thing is just guesswork on your part those propert…

Look anywhere in rural areas of high tax states in Great Lakes/Midwest/Northeast, such as southern Illinois or upstate NY. Even homes in CT/NJ away from the urban centers are down in real value, maybe flat or slightly higher in nominal value.

Certain regions of the country are hot, certain regions are nowhere near. Even the differences in the regions of the US where house prices are rising exhibit a wide range from many areas only experiencing slight changes to others in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It depends if your region has the amenities people with money are looking for or if it has access to large numbers of high paying jobs.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#97

Post by pkaye »

ghaff wrote: post #61
mumblemumble wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're talking the US, that law is for the benefit of the rich. In general, the interest won't exceed the standard deduction unless you've got a rather obscenely priced home.

That didn't use to be the case. The mortgage interest deduction used to be a solidly middle class benefit. But, yes, with relatively recent changes to the tax code, it's a lot harder for most people to hit the standard deduction and therefore mortgage interest is often not deductible unless someone has a higher end home in an expensive area.

Isn't there a cap on mortgage interest deductions at this point?

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#98

Post by ryathal »

dragonwriter wrote: post #89
sokoloff wrote: post #19

COVID added two factors, both positive for housing prices: additional time in the home, making its faults more apparent and spending money to address them more sensible. It also added trillions of dollars of government borrowing without creating offsetting trillions of dollars of production in the economy, leading many to worry about an uptick in inflation. As inflation fears increase, borrowing money and buying prod…

Three: widespread (and in many cases transitioning to long term) WFH: that’s not just time in the home, its new demands on what the home is used for.

Four: a 1-3 month pause in new construction, and construction materials.

Five: record low interest rates are here to stay so borrowers can pay more up front for the same payment.

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#99

Post by closeparen »

akudha wrote: post #51
mc32 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of it is to take money out of authoritarian regimes and move it into more rule of law countries. Another reason is a hedge against inflation which we may be beginning to see right now.

The very fact that you are trying to rationalize someone buying multiple homes at the expense of someone trying to buy their first home highlights the problem. Take Canada for example. A whole lot of homes are bought by Chinese buyers and are sitting idle, at the expense of Canadians trying to buy their first home. How can you say this is morally right? It is all find and dandy for the Chinese buyers, but what of Can…

Would it be moral to collapse the wealth of the 70% of Canadians who own homes?

Re: House prices surpass housing-bubble peak on price-to-rent ratio

#100

Post by hnburnsy »

thehappypm wrote: post #93

This is way more about a drop in rents than anything else, obviously. Rents are super low nationwide right now, as folks abandoned high-rent areas in the pandemic. Meanwhile the housing market is very long-term oriented, and reasonably rational.

Looks like in many places rents are much higher...

https://www.apartmentguide.com/blog/apartment-guide-annual-r...

'The following cities have experienced the biggest increases in one-bedroom rent prices year-over-year. None of them make the 10 most expensive markets for one-bedroom apartments by rent prices. Three of them — Gilbert, AZ; Buffalo, NY and Durham, NC — have populations of 300,000 or less.

Kansas City, MO (+33.5%)

Gilbert, AZ (+26.0%)

Las Vegas, NV (+25.3%)

Riverside, CA (+24.9%)

Buffalo, NY (+23.3%)

Columbus, OH (+22.1%)

Durham, NC (+20.0%)

Detroit, MI (+18.6%)

New Orleans, LA (+18.3%)

Virginia Beach, VA (+15.3%)

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