What if remote work didn’t mean working from home? • Hacker News Board

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#211

Post by rewgs » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:22 AM UTC

geoduck14 wrote: post #180

rewgs wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have 30+ food allergies that developed as an adult (which includes alcohol). Yes, it's ridiculous. I literally cannot eat food that isn't prepared by me from a hilariously small and ever-shrinking list of approved ingredients. I also can't prepare food more than a day in advance due to a histamine intolerance (food grows in histamine count as it sits in the fridge), so roughly 50% of my free time is spent cooking,…

That sucks. If I wanted to bond with you - what could we do aside from food and drinks? Would you go bowling with me? Could we play cricket in a nearby field? Can we sing karaoke? Would it be better or worse if our coworkers were drunk while singing?

Ha, thanks for asking. Sure, all that works (and more) except the karaoke. Long story short, I have another chronic illness known as hyperacusis. Google it if you care.

But a more valuable answer has less to do with me personally and more to do with people with tons of food allergies in general:

-We are probably down to invite you over and cook for you. Just be prepared for stuff with lots of alternatives, or somewhat strange dishes. That said, I can eat steak and potatoes, so I'm always down to grill.

-If we go do a thing, like bowling, understand that the time might be a little earlier or later than we'd like, because I might want to eat first or duck out early to go home to eat. I can get by if I bring snacks, but unfortunately there just aren't many non-perishable snacks that I can eat.

-Day trips tend to be limited since I can't just grab food somewhere. Same deal as above applies. This is honestly the worst. I miss just heading out somewhere for a long day on the weekend, getting brunch, then dinner, then ice cream...man. The freedom is incredible.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#212

Post by rewgs » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:22 AM UTC

artur_makly wrote: post #164

rewgs wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have 30+ food allergies that developed as an adult (which includes alcohol). Yes, it's ridiculous. I literally cannot eat food that isn't prepared by me from a hilariously small and ever-shrinking list of approved ingredients. I also can't prepare food more than a day in advance due to a histamine intolerance (food grows in histamine count as it sits in the fridge), so roughly 50% of my free time is spent cooking,…

thank you for your eloquence and honesty and bravery. I wish more folks on HN would attempt to write like this..me included. don't stop.

Thank you. I put pride into my writing, so I really appreciate you saying that.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#213

Post by valand » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:40 AM UTC

hinkley wrote: post #181

valand wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personal experience which is at the very opposite point of the spectrum from yours. I have had the pleasurable working in a team where bonding is simply working toward a common goal. This was an extremely cohesive team. Our main motivation of working long hour was to push the company to a more beneficial position so that we are also benefited from it. The reward is the good result of the work itself and going home/ou…

Did you have much banter in meetings, or were the organizers all business? Some places make it very hard to bond during work hours.

If we're assembled ahead of time, yes, but usually everyone is all business to keep the meetings short and packed.

Outside of meetings, yes we had banters. We were nerds, so we conversed about nerdy things, which sometimes are spin-offs of our works. Another it was about food because who don't love food?

The workplace was a small open-plan office, 27 desk max in that room. When stressed and needing someone to talk to, I would see if anyone didnot have earphones on and are not working. I guess that was the "busy"/"not busy" signal.

> Some places make it very hard to bond during work hours.

I guess yeah, moreover if there are physical or procedural separator between people.

Also, I realized I don't feel the same atmosphere once we grew into a larger company with varying prople with varying interests. I guess it was a niche kind of thing.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#214

Post by asdff » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:46 AM UTC

CoastalCoder wrote: post #85

JohnWhigham wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Classic HN missing the point of social interaction and the benefits it provides.

I think the problem with something like (specifically) Happy Hour is that it's really welcome by some employees, and really hated by others. Imagine being one of the few Mormons, observant Muslims, or recovering alcoholics at a company that "rewards" your team with Happy Hours. Or being someone who's been sexually harassed or assaulted at previous events where coworkers drank too much. I'm not suggesting that it's ea…

What you describe, company sponsored fun times, sound a little toxic. But just buddies hanging out is a valuable option for people who need a social outlet. A lot of times, after undergrad and you move to a new city, it becomes exceedingly difficult to meet other people and make friends. You don't have to be friends with your coworkers, but if you are, even shitty jobs can feel a lot more bearable in my experience. In the beforetimes we had a standing happyhour. Some coworkers never showed up and that was fine. Some showed up but only drank water and that was also fine. If you work somewhere that alienates you instead of not caring at all about the highschool clicky bullshit, I'd run for the hills.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#215

Post by asdff » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:53 AM UTC

bluefirebrand wrote: post #55

kristjansson wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone of course, and one should be attentive to and accommodating of teammates that feel that way. But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people?

"Thanks for all the hard work, let's knock off at three today" Is a positive. "Let's go down to the pub" is still capitalizing on my time. It's still work, just the location has changed. And in the past it has often started at 3 and then kept going and going until way later than if I'd just worked out my day. There is always some idealism around it like "oh if you don't drink you don't have to, just come hang out for…

I can't believe that's real life for some people. I would never drink with someone who has "team player" in their dictionary unironically. That being said, the vast majority of my coworkers, all of them actually, are not robots like that. If they were, I would find a new job fast. If you are in a place like this currently, there are greener pastures my friend. Seek them out. Find people who don't care that you go home to beat traffic instead of hitting up the bar. They exist.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#216

Post by asdff » Wed, May 26, 2021, 4:56 AM UTC

wott wrote: post #113

kristjansson wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone of course, and one should be attentive to and accommodating of teammates that feel that way. But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people?

> But surely “let’s knock off at three today and go down the pub, thanks for all the hard work” is a positive for most people? Definitely not. 1. I am not fond of drinking with workmates. An occasional, incidental, one-on-one or not much more: OK. In groups ("teams"): no thanks, this isn't school, we are not students, so no pseudo school party. 2. I abhor having drinks with people who have any kind of hierarchical po…

You don't have to go to the pub. You can just say something like, "I better go home now and get ahead of the traffic, have a good time!" then proceed to find a new job if they actually give you flak from that.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#217

Post by asdff » Wed, May 26, 2021, 5:05 AM UTC

dasil003 wrote: post #132

neilv wrote: post #128

In the early 2000s, when I was sharing a really dumpy student apartment, and had no office, I often spent the day working around town, mostly from parks and cafes. Cafes can be distracting, but they had power for charging old laptop batteries, for the cost of a coffee, and sometimes had free WiFi. Probably most productive were park benches, and sitting under particular trees. I carried a bag with a laptop, a high-pow…

An M1 macbook would be perfect for this sitting-under-a-tree lifestyle, the cherry on top would be built-in 5G, but that is a minor gap compared to battery/display brightness.

Are the batteries actually worthy in these? When I got my macbook (intel) Apple claimed 10 hours. Reviews claimed 10 hours. I get 5 hours with the mail app open and an ssh connection to our server. Even took it to the apple store and they said the battery is fine. If a zoom meeting is over an hour I need a charger.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#218

Post by jakecopp » Wed, May 26, 2021, 5:08 AM UTC

ryandrake wrote: post #195

deviation wrote: post #142

Some people fail to recognise the actual problem here. I, among many, live within The deciding factors were - that I didn't have to leave the room for a personal call so that I didn't disturb anyone. - that I didn't need to have six seperate conversations in the morning before being able to sit down and begin my work. - that I didn't need to sacrifice portions of my lunchtime to grab a coffee with others and look lik…

Different stokes for different folks. To me, WFH purely means I avoid my crushing 2.5hr-each-way commute. If my employer built an office next to my house, I'd happily go to the office every day. Or even better, if my employer built an office in a cheaper cost-of-living area like the Nevada desert, I could move to a trailer there and happily go to the office every day. I'm not enamored with my home office. I don't rea…

May I ask how you came to live 2.5 hours away? Are you not able to move closer? Is rent too expensive closer?

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#219

Post by asdff » Wed, May 26, 2021, 5:08 AM UTC

pomian wrote: post #190

neilv wrote: post #128

In the early 2000s, when I was sharing a really dumpy student apartment, and had no office, I often spent the day working around town, mostly from parks and cafes. Cafes can be distracting, but they had power for charging old laptop batteries, for the cost of a coffee, and sometimes had free WiFi. Probably most productive were park benches, and sitting under particular trees. I carried a bag with a laptop, a high-pow…

Except the screen technology, which seems worse. The higher end the laptop the worse it seems to work in the sun light. My last good sunlight laptop was a super cheap atom based 11" Acer. I accomplished more on that than any Alienware, XPS, etc - because it worked in any light, and the batteries lasted longer than me.

New macs are fine. I have an air which is 20% less bright as a pro, and its fine in sunlight. A pro would be even better. I typically work outside on my patio with the laptop sitting in direct sun often. OSX also cranks up the gamma when it detects bright light to help resolve blacks a little better. Battery life is probably suffering though, its better to find shade. The screen is plenty visible at half brightness in shade.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#220

Post by conductr » Wed, May 26, 2021, 5:34 AM UTC

Aeolun wrote: post #203

conductr wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It gave me a chance to say "thanks" "Me" is the key word > and for us to bond over the challenge we overcame. That occurred already. It happened through the process of overcoming the challenge. I get the intent, but your people probably just want to rest and get some of their time back. If you must celebrate, do it during hours. I typically did offsite lunch time activities pre-COVID. Now it's more gift driven and…

I don’t know. For me, I’m very much looking forward to having dinner and a party with my co-workers again. I don’t want that every week, but the once every 3 months’ish that we had going was pretty nice.

That’s a bit different than when the leader wants to celebrate your long hours by making you work more hours in a social capacity.

It’s very much different strokes for different folks. Just like everyone’s personal lives differ so does their appetite for coworker extracurricular activities. But I agree that the every 3 months or so is a fine cadence. But, 1) schedule it at the beginning of the quarter 2) be ready to reschedule it if it coincides with a sprint of long hours.

In a perfect world, your team would tell you if they were too burned out for it or not, in a judgement free way. But that doesn’t happen due to fear of judgment or not wanting to rock the boat (say nay when others want yay) or multitude of other reasons. Point is, if you know anyone on the team has significant others, kids, pets, or any life outside work you as a leader shouldn’t ask them to work more in the name of celebration.