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What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

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Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#151

Post by srinivgp »

mLuby wrote: post #121
bluefirebrand wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think there might not be the perfect reward/thank you for everyone There is actually. It's called big stacks of money. Oddly, companies don't seem to want to reward people with it, the one universal thing that basically everyone could appreciate and is the entire reason anyone works anywhere in the first place. Crazy. It's almost like playing relatively small amounts for a big expensive catered meal saves the com…

I value a $50 gift or experience with my team far more than an extra $50 electronically added to my account. Presentation matters.

Well stop. You're the one encouraging this bad behavior.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#152

Post by IggleSniggle »

shannongreen wrote: post #143
legerdemain wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

THIS, 100% this. I don't want to be "social" with you, I don't want to "bond" with you, and I don't care about you as a human being. You are 100% just a queue of work tasks and a source of pay checks. The less I see, hear, or know about the other people on my team, the happier I am and the better off they are . WFH forever, don't mess with a good thing.

FWIW, I would hate working with someone like this. You don't have to be super active, socially, but treating the other people (and they _are_ people) on your team as just drones is a) not conducive to good collaboration and b) pretty damn rude.

It doesn’t have to be rude. Seeing it as rude is an imposition on those of us who don’t see it as rude.

I’m pretty antisocial, personally, and love it when my workmates get to the point and focus on the actual “drone”-tasks. Why? Because that is why I do software. I don’t do software because I love people. I don’t do software because I love the paycheck. I do software because I love software and every second away from focusing on the concerns of producing quality software just seems like a genuine waste of time. Even here on HN, it’s mostly an opportunity to safely experiment with “politics” in a way that isn’t totally exhausting.

I get that everyone is not like me, and I’m okay with that. I don’t expect everyone to have my preferences.

I’d personally prefer to be treated as a respected “drone” (now THAT seems rude) and I don’t really want to spend time on banter, unless it’s being used as a metaphor that can improve our collective output.

This is “fun.” This is why I “work” (it’s not work to me). Discussing requirements and problem solving solutions is great; it’s fun. Happy hour is “work” to me. Please don’t act like I’m rude just because I don’t share your preferences.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#153

Post by syshum »

mtalantikite wrote: post #33

I've been working remote for 13 years now and I really wish I had rented an office outside of my house much earlier than I did. At 23 your threshold for pain and discomfort is I think much higher in many ways, but I definitely burnt myself out by having my workspace also be my living space (small apartment in NYC). Once I started sharing a loft space with some friends to co-work out of things got a lot more enjoyable…

Key there is a dedicated space for an office. This may be renting an office space outside your living space, or if you live anywhere that is not a large city chances are you can afford a larger place that would include a dedicated space for an office for much less than renting an office would be.

Around here a 1 Bed room apartment + small office rental would be FAR FAR FAR more costly than simply renting a 2 bedroom apartment.

1 year ago, before home prices skyrocketed, it would have been very economical to buy a 2 or 3 bedroom home in order to have a dedicated office space.

Granted that only applies if you do not live in one of the top 50 Metro's, and if your job is not really fully remote why would you want to stay in a high cost of living location?

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#154

Post by lazyasciiart »

late2part wrote: post #150
dylan604 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nope. i've never worked for a company that gave away stock. i also never wear the swag t-shirts/hoodies that companies give out to employees (or worse sell). why?

Thank you for answering. I ask because I have this theory that there is a correlation between employees who don't mind working more to make stock to go up if they have stock. It's never a simple analysis. I don't mind working more for a deadline if I recognize a tangible increase in revenue or cost savings, as I benefit from the stock. "Gave away" is an interesting term. In our company, stock is 10-40% of our compens…

I've always worked for companies where stock is part of the compensation and people still don't want to work long hours.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#155

Post by lotsofpulp »

late2part wrote: post #150
dylan604 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nope. i've never worked for a company that gave away stock. i also never wear the swag t-shirts/hoodies that companies give out to employees (or worse sell). why?

Thank you for answering. I ask because I have this theory that there is a correlation between employees who don't mind working more to make stock to go up if they have stock. It's never a simple analysis. I don't mind working more for a deadline if I recognize a tangible increase in revenue or cost savings, as I benefit from the stock. "Gave away" is an interesting term. In our company, stock is 10-40% of our compens…

> In our company, stock is 10-40% of our compensation, so it aligns our motives in a way that folks without stock don't have.

Is it a publicly listed company? If not, how do you mitigate or incorporate the risk of being diluted and/or not being able to cash out?

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#156

Post by dylan604 »

late2part wrote: post #150
dylan604 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nope. i've never worked for a company that gave away stock. i also never wear the swag t-shirts/hoodies that companies give out to employees (or worse sell). why?

Thank you for answering. I ask because I have this theory that there is a correlation between employees who don't mind working more to make stock to go up if they have stock. It's never a simple analysis. I don't mind working more for a deadline if I recognize a tangible increase in revenue or cost savings, as I benefit from the stock. "Gave away" is an interesting term. In our company, stock is 10-40% of our compens…

There's a term that's used "not real money", and the stock-as-compensation is an example. There are plenty of examples of people working their asses off on the hope/promise/gamble that it will be rewarded with a high stock price and then the stock not reaching those soaring heights or worse the company runs out of runway and the stock is worthless. Now those people realize they were making a lot less money than they thought. There's also the larger than 0% chance that the market tanks and everyone's value goes kaput again leaving the employee high and dry. Let's also not discount those companies that require employees to work a minimum time in years before those options vest.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#157

Post by ne0flex »

deviation wrote: post #142

Some people fail to recognise the actual problem here. I, among many, live within The deciding factors were - that I didn't have to leave the room for a personal call so that I didn't disturb anyone. - that I didn't need to have six seperate conversations in the morning before being able to sit down and begin my work. - that I didn't need to sacrifice portions of my lunchtime to grab a coffee with others and look lik…

Fully agree. I have about a 15min walk away from my work place. Recently, my company has annoucned its re-entry plan and have decided on a hybrid work environment in order to "foster collaboration and increase productivity." My department was classified as a 'mostly-essential' department which means that we'd be required to be in the office 3 -4 days a week.

I immediately emailed management requesting a near 100% transition to WFH, at least for me, and made the argument that my KPIs have more than doubled in 2020 vs. 2019. Working from home has allowed me the flexibility to not get burned out between meetings and as a result I booked more than 2x client meetings. In terms of collaboration, the main person on my team I collaborate with was relocated to San Franscisco, so I need to collaborate with him digitally anyway.

Also, despite closing more deals this year, I only received a 3.5% pay increase, and a $1K bonus increase over 2019. My 2019 numbers were abysmal compared to my 2020 numbers, and in 2019 I received a 4.4% salary increase. So more productivity doesn't get me bigger pay raises I guess.

Currently waiting to see what stupid bullshit they try to spin in order not to accommodate my request. My boss already told me that he'd support me WFH if it means I'll be able to keep up my current numbers. I'm thinking of telling management that I'm willing to overlook the slap-in-the-face pay increase if they'd accommodate permanent WFH for me / only need to go into the office as necessary.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#158

Post by agjm »

geoduck14 wrote: post #12
bluefirebrand wrote: post #2

As long as I still have a quiet, private office and don't spend an hour+ per day in traffic and am not expected to give up evenings for "not mandatory but really you should show up to play politics" office happy hours, I don't care where I work. Currently working from home gives me all of that and I haven't been happier with a job ever.

Regarding the Happy Hours: In 2019, my team would occasionally need to work long hours or would deliver something awesome. I would reward them with HH and dinner/late meal. It gave me a chance to say "thanks" and for us to bond over the challenge we overcame. I can't do that anymore! I've don't virtual HH, but it isn't the same! I would REALLY like a virtual solution to "bond with your team" and "say thanks in a mean…

I am the type of person who appreciates this sort of thing, but it seems like we're in the minority.

Growing up, I always loved getting to see people from school / school clubs (e.g. FSAE team, photography, etc) out of the normal context. It really opens up relationships and helps you figure out how to work better as a team.

If someone's not there because they don't want anything to do with work after hours, it's hard to treat them fairly -- the people who do show up are going to start viewing them as an outsider, and they might get passed up on promotion for someone that the higher-ups got to know better after office hours. So, objectively, having a happy hour probably tends to punish the people that don't show up, turning it into a mandatory function. I'd never really thought about it that way.

That said, I'd still prefer to have them.

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#159

Post by bluedino »

cujo wrote: post #32
JohnWhigham wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Classic HN missing the point of social interaction and the benefits it provides.

Classic comment missing the point that not everyone needs or wants the social interaction with their work mates.

Closer team’s performance is probably higher than teams that don’t socialize together

Re: What if remote work didn’t mean working from home?

#160

Post by syshum »

qshaman wrote: post #103
bluefirebrand wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, all of those things are better than living in cities. Less noise, less crowding, less violence and crime, more space, more peace, and more friendliness.

How so? There is way more stuff to do in the city, than in rural Ohio (for example), friendliness is very subjective, if you are "one of them" then yes, they will be nice to you, if you look different, then things change. More space? duh, there is a reason no one wants to live there. Less people == less crime and violence (most of the time). Less noise, yeah, thats true.

If you are one for the Night Life, bars, events, etc then sure pre-covid and maybe post covid the city was for you.

For many people however "City Life" was for economic reality, that is where the work is, so that is where they were. They did not care about "night life", hated having to shop daily for groceries, etc etc

"Boring" suburban life is appealing to ALOT of people, boring life where the most exciting thing that happens is old bob hit something with the mower...

As to "one of them", this is true for many communities including the city, when "country folk" come into the city they are often treated with hostility and disdain. In fact I would say poor treatment of "outsiders" is MORE common and MORE pronounced in cities than in suburbs. This however could be my personal experience showing through as I grew up in the country around farmers, and conservative (not political but in the reserved traditional sense of the word) so I was an outsider in the city.

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