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Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

9to5google.com

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Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#261

Post by macspoofing »

lghh wrote: post #173
macspoofing wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A little hyperbolic, don't you think? If you're writing Fuchsia OS, then you don't a conscience?

That's clearly not what I said. I was responding directly to my parent comment which said we should try to separate a work from the context in which it operates. It was not a value statement on Fuchsia OS, anyone who worked on it, or anyone on Google. It was simply a statement on separating work from the context in which it operates.

>It was not a value statement on Fuchsia OS, anyone who worked on it, or anyone on Google.

This thread is about Fuchsia OS - so you're separating your statement from the context in which it operates?

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#262

Post by Zambyte »

forgotpwd16 wrote: post #101
kerneis wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fuchsia, like Chrome, has been open-source for years, and all commits and reviews as well as the bug tracker are public. It is a very different model from how Android releases work. (Disclaimer: I work on Fuchsia at Google.)

Is Fuchsia meant only for embedded devices (smart displays, smartphones, etc) or will there be laptop releases akin to Chromebooks?

Smart phones are definitely general purpose computers

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#263

Post by SixDouble5321 »

raxxorrax wrote: post #113
Grazester wrote: post #63

I came here for a technical discussion about Fuchsia and it's microkernel approach instead this is mostly fill with complains about Google as a company. Is there a social justice forum I can visit where I may be able to have a technical discussion about Fuchsia?

I think the discussion cannot be really detached, since Google has strong ambitions that will undeniably influence features and capabilities of their OS. But as for the microkernel approach, I think the advantages are on the table, but they are theoretical. Until now, no OS with a micro architecture was successful at getting significant market share. What would your requirements at an OS like this be? For me, it woul…

>Until now, no OS with a micro architecture was successful at getting significant market share.

Not sure in what sense you mean this. Minix may be the most common OS on the planet. Intel embedded it in an quite a number of its products.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#264

Post by pjmlp »

snvzz wrote: post #217
pjmlp wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

POSIX clones.

POSIX is a specification. Implementations are implementations, not clones. And most of the systems you listed aren't even aiming for POSIX-compatibility. Can you please clarify what your intent was by using the word "clones"?

That was it, if you want to be pedantic, be my guest.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#265

Post by cute_boi »

SquareWheel wrote: post #236
cute_boi wrote: post #227

Its just a attack on linux. Just like what they did to firefox. Made a superior browser and make it opensource and gain monopoly. Now they have control over os. They can do anything.

Wake me up when they do that "anything". In the mean time they've created useful and successful open-source products which anyone can benefit from.

Yea I can see that with chrome. They created useful in that time that any opensource benefit others. After that they started writing their own spec for chrome, made youtube slow on firefox using shadow dom api etc.

These I think google is more evil that microsoft. But many people enjoy free service thats why they are not complaining.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#266

Post by KozmoNau7 »

lacksconfidence wrote: post #251
KozmoNau7 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps it would useful for Google and googlers to "read the room" - as it were - and consider why a lot of people have such strong reactions to Google's conduct and methods, why a lot of people are distrustful of anything that comes out of Google (and FAANG in general), and why the reactions are so strong from privacy advocates and the open source/free software crowd in particular, in context of where and how Google…

I'm not sure what you are suggesting here. Should the developers that work on specific input methods for fuscia be "reading the room" and instead spend their time switching to work on ad tech, where they can influence it? Google has 10's of thousands of engineers, wedging ad tech discussions into the output of every last one of them seems completely and utterly unrelated to the article.

I would humbly suggest that people working for companies that have become notorious for customer-unfriendly behavior and a complete disregard for privacy, reconsider whether that is something they wish to continue to contribute to, or not. Do they wish to contribute to the coffers of a company that will use every possible means available to erode privacy, to extract maximum value from open source without giving one iota back, and to enforce more and more corporate censorship on the open web.

Advertising and a complete disregard for privacy is in every part of Google's DNA, you cannot possibly claim ignorance of it, simply because you are in a department not directly working on advertising. That is equivalent to covering your ears with your hands and going "la la la I can't hear you".

That is why it gets brought up in every discussion about Google, because one bad apple really does spoil the entire bunch, their bad behavior in regards to privacy and a complete lack of customer support taints the entire organization, and everyone who works for Google has sold their respectability for a Silicon Valley paycheck.

Everyone who works in tech needs to take a good long hard look in the mirror, and decide for themselves whether they're OK with everything their employer is doing, and if not, perhaps consider why they choose to still work there.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#267

Post by awa »

DebtDeflation wrote: post #96
piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

I'm so done with this smart home stuff. "Alexa, turn on Living Room." "I'm sorry, I'm having trouble understanding now." I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on. I don't even want to think about a smart thermostat. My dumb thermostat from 10 years ago let's me set timers which is all I reall…

I have been presently surprised with Google Assistant in this regard, the integration with my TV (with new Google TV Chromecast) is amazing and a lot of time I don't bother to pick up the remote. (Saying things like "Play xyz on TV", switches on the TV, figures out the right app and starts playing the show saving me 4-5 actions on the remote)

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#268

Post by e12e »

Grazester wrote: post #63

I came here for a technical discussion about Fuchsia and it's microkernel approach instead this is mostly fill with complains about Google as a company. Is there a social justice forum I can visit where I may be able to have a technical discussion about Fuchsia?

Has anyone done a comparison with Minix 3? What are the (dis)advantages to a new microkernel rather than building on Minix 3?

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#269

Post by kerneis »

trasz wrote: post #234
kerneis wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key concepts are documented here: https://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/concepts Some things that Fuchsia was able to do thanks to starting from scratch: - The system is based on capabilities, a security model which is based on explicit tracking of permissions. It wouldn't be possible to change Linux to be capability-based because the ambiant-authority model has been used pervasively since it was conceived 30 years ago…

Implementing capability-based security in a typical Unix (and thus Linux) is definitely possible, see FreeBSD's Capsicum.

I don't know a lot about Capsicum, but from what I remember (and see from their website) it adds capabilities to FreeBSD but doesn't make them mandatory. As such, it is a tool to build compartimentalized applications. It does not provide a comprehensive solution to sandbox existing applications, and does not remove the ambiant-authority model. It is a better, safer chroot(). Fuchsia, on the other hand, is built on top of capabilities from the ground up, ensuring that you don't even have a concept of "file descriptor" or "centralized filesystem" to begin with.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#270

Post by ori_b »

kerneis wrote: post #185
ori_b wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many of your colleagues are outside Google?

I'm not sure I understand the question, but you may be interested in the following article about Samsung contributing to Fuchsia: https://9to5google.com/2021/05/12/samsung-contributing-f2fs-...

Your implication is that Google is not treating Fuchsia as a 'throw it over the wall' project, but as one with community participation. How many of your colleagues are from outside of Google? How often do you work with non-googlers as you develop it?

Are you regularly reviewing code submitted by your colleages at Samsung?

The fact that you're confused by the concept of working with people outside your company doesn't bode well for the open-sourceness of this project.

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