Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub • Hacker News Board

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#131

Post by akeck » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:46 PM UTC

DebtDeflation wrote: post #96

piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

I'm so done with this smart home stuff. "Alexa, turn on Living Room." "I'm sorry, I'm having trouble understanding now." I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on. I don't even want to think about a smart thermostat. My dumb thermostat from 10 years ago let's me set timers which is all I reall…

We put Etekcity remote controlled sockets in a few places and stopped there. That being said, apparently you can buy a radio module to control them from a raspi, but we haven't gone there yet.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#132

Post by archiepeach » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:47 PM UTC

DebtDeflation wrote: post #96

piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

I'm so done with this smart home stuff. "Alexa, turn on Living Room." "I'm sorry, I'm having trouble understanding now." I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on. I don't even want to think about a smart thermostat. My dumb thermostat from 10 years ago let's me set timers which is all I reall…

I've actually had a really positive experience using a smart thermostat. The main benefit is having a temperature schedule, which my previous dumb thermostat didn't have. It's also handy being able to adjust the temperature from my phone whenever I'd like to. I find controlling it by voice kind of pointless. On the phone, you can easily see what it's currently at, then adjust it for the next e.g. hour, after which it'll switch back to the default schedule.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#133

Post by cogman10 » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:49 PM UTC

_Microft wrote: post #10

piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

You might want to add: [I wonder] when it will be discontinued with just a one month's notice and will turn my device into a brick.

This is the bigger risk. I don't see Fuchsia as a walled garden OS as it's pretty well designed to avoid that. Userspace everything with a microkernel makes for a nice small security footprint for IoT devices that can be perpetually updated.

The issue is how long google keeps up "perpetual".

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#134

Post by radlad » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:50 PM UTC

DebtDeflation wrote: post #96

piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

I'm so done with this smart home stuff. "Alexa, turn on Living Room." "I'm sorry, I'm having trouble understanding now." I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on. I don't even want to think about a smart thermostat. My dumb thermostat from 10 years ago let's me set timers which is all I reall…

> I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on.

That doesn't sound right. All the Zigbee/Z-Wave switches I use maintain proper state through HA, even if they lose connectivity for a period of time.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#135

Post by helsinkiandrew » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:51 PM UTC

Semaphor wrote: post #105

DebtDeflation wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm so done with this smart home stuff. "Alexa, turn on Living Room." "I'm sorry, I'm having trouble understanding now." I mean, yeah, I can toggle the light switch to get it to turn on, but then it gets screwed up and I need to go into the app to reset it when the internet comes back on. I don't even want to think about a smart thermostat. My dumb thermostat from 10 years ago let's me set timers which is all I reall…

You don’t want a remote-controlled smart (actually: dumb) home. You want a fully local solution, then you can add remote, internet-dependent functionality like alexa to it. That way your primary mode of control will always work.

And get some motion detectors. Your lights should come on when someone enters the room and the light is below a threshold. I usually hit the off switch by the door when I leave, otherwise if no one is present the lack of movement will dim and then turn the lights off. It's 2021 people!

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#136

Post by TchoBeer » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:51 PM UTC

znpy wrote: post #82

rootsudo wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really is. Things get comfortable and people assume that's always how it was. Like cell phones. Wow, over a decade of them and if you had one 15 years ago you were considered a early adapter, and 20 years ago you were way ahead the curve. If you had one in the 90's, wow. Still, mobile computer in your pocket, wow.

> Still, mobile computer in your pocket, wow. it really bothers me, you know? we've got so much storage and so many/good sensors, yet the software kinda pushes you to use the device for watching dumb videos and/or to argue worthlessly with other random people, so that you can get served ads in the meantime.

What else do you think people ought to do with them? They're pretty small, so e.g. reading a book is a bit difficult, and using them as general purpose computers is difficult because they lack a keyboard (and thus an easy way to program them).

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#137

Post by tester34 » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:51 PM UTC

Spivak wrote: post #120

macspoofing wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You cannot separate a work from the context in which it operates. Why not try?

Because then work just becomes a more boring riff on the Nuremberg defense. You can't just be like "I'm just paid to write code and so will completely ignore any and all ethical issues with what my company does with it." There's a reason the ACM code of ethics has "everyone is a stakeholder" and "avoid harm" as the top two overriding principles. I can understand arguments about keeping political issues unrelated to y…

it's ok

there's dont be evil

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#138

Post by loudmax » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:51 PM UTC

Google234 wrote: post #4

rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #3

What's the community-driven alternative?

There is no other micro kernel OS being developed with similar effort.

There is seL4: https://sel4.systems/

The resources going into seL4 appear to be nowhere near "similar effort" to what Google is putting into Fuchsia, but it is a legitimate alternative.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#139

Post by pjmlp » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:52 PM UTC

IntelMiner wrote: post #13

piokoch wrote: post #2

10 years ago I would be really excited, as I could expect some groundbreaking tech like search engine or revolutionary approach to something, like Gmail (no ads sent to users, great UI, hige disk space). Today, instead of excitement, I am wondering how this thing is going to push me in some walled garden, how I will be tracked, how my data will be fetched and sold, what will be the trick used to move people away from…

To add to the pot of cynics I wonder how much of it is driven to supplant Linux's "viral" GPL-ness

All new FOSS OS clones are BSD/Apache licensed.

RTOS, Azure RTOS, mbed, NuXX, Zephyr

For sure it isn't a coincidence.

Re: Google is officially releasing Fuchsia OS, starting with a first-gen Nest Hub

#140

Post by kerneis » Tue, May 25, 2021, 1:54 PM UTC

forgotpwd16 wrote: post #101

kerneis wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fuchsia, like Chrome, has been open-source for years, and all commits and reviews as well as the bug tracker are public. It is a very different model from how Android releases work. (Disclaimer: I work on Fuchsia at Google.)

Is Fuchsia meant only for embedded devices (smart displays, smartphones, etc) or will there be laptop releases akin to Chromebooks?

If you are interested in running Fuchsia on a laptop or desktop device, you probably want to follow the Workstation product effort:

- https://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/contribute/roadmap/2021/work...

- https://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/contribute/governance/rfcs/0...

And as mentioned elsewhere, you can already build Fuchsia for an Intel NUC, with keyboard, mouse, ethernet and external screen support: https://fuchsia.dev/fuchsia-src/development/hardware/intel_n...