I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled • Hacker News Board

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#161

Post by elygre » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:41 AM UTC

olivermarks wrote: post #30

SF District Attorney Chesa Boudin ran for office in November 2019 focusing his campaign on ending mass incarceration with restorative justice models, rather than punitive incarceral methods. Since then crime in SF has absolutely exploded, fuelled by proposition 47 which reduced stealing less than $900 day to a misdemeanor. Add in a massive opioid crisis and the result is a rapidly growing crisis of shoplifting, petty…

As a foreigner, though a frequent watcher of American crime shows: what exactly is a misdemeanor, and why is it bad that stealing is one? What changed when it was reclassified?

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#162

Post by dude187 » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:41 AM UTC

premium-komodo wrote: post #3

Yes, that seems to be how it is in SF. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arss9V3A1VA Is it possible that, despite good intentions, the policies being implemented there actually have very harmful effects?

I feel like a lot if it stems from people talking about petty crime like theft as some sort of "cycle". They get tricked into thinking that means you can break it by ignoring it. "Break the cycle, they will stop committing the crime!" With the only voter controlled lever being "don't prosecute crime".

It's like some sort of ridiculous over swing from "tough on crime" that relies on an infantilization of those they wish to "help". Like somehow someone who committed a crime and got punished couldn't know right from wrong, and punishing them for that just somehow reinforces that, and just simply... not punishing them for it helps?

It's such a narrow view that ignores the fact that real people own these stores, actual adults shop there, criminals know that they can just steal free shit without consequence, and all of those sorts of normal people just say "fuck it" and eventually move. Nobody will put up with being a constant victim as some sort of "aid" to the situation, including those that vote for it. The ones that vote for it just don't have enough exposure to the aspects of society they're forcing to take the punishment for this crap. They force others to suffer the punishment for it, in lieu of the criminals they actually _reward_ for doing it.

After decades of "tough on crime" policies, this kind of shit was on the retreat. It objectively helped everyone involved. Sadly I think the real cycle is in people who subscribe their religion against law enforcement eventually legalizing most sorts of victimization, and then leaving when the chickens come to roost. Moving elsewhere to vote in politicians with that same sort of virus like mentality, and leaving behind wastelands that by their logic need this "soft on crime" treatment more than anywhere.

It's like freaking independence day, except instead of "resources" that the alien nomads invade to harvest it's a proper functioning society.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#163

Post by hitekker » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:41 AM UTC

devoutsalsa wrote: post #55

84fryb75 wrote: post #9

In early 2020, before lockdown, I visited San Francisco as a tourist with my wife. We took a wrong turn at a book store and wound up on a street covered in feces. The next street was fine. Then on the next, we watched a homeless woman shoot up on the street. Then a supercar pulled into a garage. I'm not the best traveled, I'll admit, so I can't compare SF to foreign cities. I'm a simple hillbilly from the Southeast,…

Yeah, I lived in the Tendernob neighborhood of SF for almost 10 years. I’d always pass by a lot of what you’re talking about... - At one point I did a lot of walking there and to keep myself entertained I started tracking PPM (poops per mile) - one day I walked by a woman peeing between two cars, and she noticed me & apologized. Later I walked back that same route and saw her again. She thanked me for not yelling at…

> - I gave a beer to a homeless guy, and he chugged it & threw the can into the street. I asked him why he didn’t put it in the trash can right next to us, and he explained that he didn’t want the tiny Asian women who forage for recyclables to get stabbed by the needles in the trash cans, and that one of them would be along to get the can shortly. Sure enough, less than 5 minutes later, a woman pushing a shopping cart full of cans walked by, picked up the beer can, and continued on.

There's something unsettling about this story that I can't quite put my finger on.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#164

Post by paulmd » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:41 AM UTC

caycep wrote: post #45

bosswipe wrote: post #20

A lot of people blame SF's prosecutor but that makes no sense, this is a policing problem. The police is lazy and won't do their job. The police union sees their role as deflecting blame while working as little as possible and collecting their six figure salaries. The reason to defund the police is because they're awful at their jobs, throwing more money after bad won't help. I know I'll be downvoted here because peo…

I would agree with this seeing public statements by LASD (Villeneueva) here in LA and his colleagues in Riverside and Orange Counties, as well as counterparts in police unions, and also unofficial chatter on twitter and elsewhere. It's not so much "progressive policies: lax on crime" vs. a reform prosecutor is in town, and I suspect there is deliberate pullback by the police unions, to let crime increase and get them…

yeah, not seeing how a $950 threshold for felony theft is causing a problem for the theft of $6000 of photography equipment, and I think that sounds like a pretty common limit for most areas.

I think there is a definite element of the cops slow-walking enforcement to make a point and get a DA who they perceive as "having their back".

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#165

Post by blabitty » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

hellotomyrars wrote: post #36

cyphertruck wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These harmful effects are intended. That is the strategy. Its important to understand why. Your life depends on it.

I'll bite. Can you please expand on what you mean by this?

I'm not who you are asking but one thing to consider is you can't have a revolution without revolutionary conditions, or put more simply, revolutions don't generally happen when times are going good.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#166

Post by sneak » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

dheera wrote: post #125

tolbish wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're thinking of Mark Rober's famous glitter bombs - https://youtube.com/watch?v=a_TSR_v07m0

Oh yes, the first two are right from those. Add some more nasty stuff, productize it, install it in cars.

Booby traps are mostly illegal. The macro solution to widespread poverty and petty theft is not found in doing petty mean things to impoverished thieves, despite the fun youtube videos that result.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#167

Post by foogazi » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

cameldrv wrote: post #132

MrFlynn wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Since then crime in SF has absolutely exploded. This is sort of misleading. Burglaries, motor vehicle thefts, and homicides went up, but all other crimes went down. Specifically in the case of homicides, there were 7 more compared to 2019. > I have never seen it this bad. Crime is still at an all time low in SF. The rate of crimes has roughly remained static for the better part of two decades. The increased number…

Murders don't just disappear, they are almost universally reported and investigated. Burglaries and car thefts need a police report to make an insurance claim. For crimes like assault though, if the police convince the victim that reporting it is pointless, it doesn't show up in the stats. Anecdotally, this is what I have heard is happening.

> Anecdotally

hmm...

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#168

Post by rebelos » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

jonahhorowitz wrote: post #136

raverbashing wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's funny how SF has turned into a daylight sociological experiment. Remove enforcement of several crimes and see it have areas reminiscent of 3rd world countries in a matter of years. (But don't expect this to be in any sociological studies, scholars will still blame "lack of education", "lack of opportunities", etc, while those have a role to play, the major factor that changed here is pretty obvious)

It's amazing what happens when the cops are in open revolt against a DA that is finally holding them accountable.

This argument is a joke. Boudin is not pressing charges. The DA is entirely the problem here.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#169

Post by tayo42 » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

aronowb14 wrote: post #73

Is anybody else getting tired of the constant stream of inflammatory posts ragging on San Francisco or the Bay Area? I feel like I've been seeing one every one or two days that make it to the top of HN. These types of posts just seem to fit into this ongoing narrative that SF (and relatedly, silicon valley), are all falling apart due to poor governance. It's beginning to feel like a strong echo chamber in here. What…

Yeah its tiring to see the negativity. Ill share my thought that's likely to attract some negative attention...

I think it's interesting this shows up a lot on tech discussion site. I see it here, I see similar sentiments on reddit too. Some of it I'm willing to bet is based in insecurity. Sf and the bay area is where a lot of the best work, hardest to get jobs are, prestigious companies exist and compensation is highest. There's people who are to scared to take the risk and move, or scared to see that they can't cut it and aren't as good or smart as they think they are. So they do things like convince them selves they don't want to be in SF, they repeat the ideas there's to much crime, its to liberal, the col is to high. Then shit post on the internet about it. We end up with these discussions not based in reality.

Re: I Was Robbed in San Francisco While the Cameras Rolled

#170

Post by tha0xb3 » Tue, May 25, 2021, 5:42 AM UTC

premium-komodo wrote: post #3

Yes, that seems to be how it is in SF. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arss9V3A1VA Is it possible that, despite good intentions, the policies being implemented there actually have very harmful effects?

All I see are peaceful reparations. If you don't allow this, it's because you value property more than lives. Black Lives Matter more than some make-up.