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How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

jeremyaboyd.com

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Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#111
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

As someone who recently switched to MacOs (not by their own choice) there are hundreds of little annoying, broken or inconsistent OS things I find. One of my favorites just happened yesterday with finder - I was trying to figure out how to rename a file, well the usual fx keys aren't doing it so the common process was to go to the toolbar context menu where hotkey is indicated next to the action's text. Rename for so…

The only reason that the return key is the 'least obvious' key to you is because you're used to that being the 'open' key on other operating systems.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#112
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

[deleted]

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#113
This post illuminates two ways in which users' expectations of computers have changed since the '80s, which is when this UX was designed:

1) Users don't deal with external storage nearly as much anymore, so the "disk image" paradigm feels out of place. Before the Internet, it was more common to insert a floppy disk, drag the application from the disk to the hard drive, and then eject it again. Users were accustomed to opening and ejecting disks based on the icons on the desktop, so when disk images started to be a thing, it worked exactly like floppies did.

2) Users think of applications that have to be explicitly installed, rather than just copied, like any other kind of file.

The second one is the really surprising one: when we think of how to get applications onto our computers these days, the word is "install". You need to install a program before you can start using it. On Windows, you ran an installer program. On Linux, you ran a command. How else can you do it?

But on Classic Mac, an application was just a special kind of file, which you could drag, drop, and manipulate just like any other kind of file.

It didn't even need to be in the Applications folder! You could put it in a subdirectory, you could put it on the Desktop, you could put it wherever you liked, and it would work just the same. I think it's a darn shame that this isn't a guarantee anymore. The other day, I tried putting all of the Microsoft Office applications into /Applications/Office instead of just in /Applications, and the next time the Office updater ran, it installed into /Applications, even though that's not where the apps lived, so now I had two copies of everything. Bleh.

Why is this so much better than running a program or running a command? Well, think about how you would uninstall a program. On Windows, you'd have to run an uninstaller or find the entry in Add/Remove programs; on Linux, you'd have to run a different command. In both cases, you'd have to do something you hadn't done before — you have to know how to do something before you can do it. On Classic Mac OS, you can just delete the application by dragging it to the Trash — something you already know how to do.

Anyway, I'm not defending this approach to installing applications. But I do think it made sense at the time, and the computing landscape changed around it.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#114

If a certain way of doing things which I am very much used to does not apply to a different environment, it does not mean the subject is not intuitive whether it's macOS, Windows, etc. To me, intuitiveness means how easy it is to operate the system correctly without prior training. Honestly, for a non-tech savvy, macOS and Windows both have many quirks and don't let me start with Linux distros (Fedora is my daily dri…

> We've had a lot of good progress so far but we need to do better.

Honestly on the desktop since the days of Windows XP I've only seen regress. I'd even argue that XP was a regress in terms of UI vis-a-vis Windows 95. The only thing that improved is hardware handling (IRQ conflicts resolution etc)

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#115
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

First, not going to claim that macOS is "intuitive", because my in my experience, "intuitive" usually means very different things to different people. As a long-time Mac, Windows, and Linux user... I'll say that there are plenty of random broken things on the Mac, but there are also a few nice things that work very consistently on the Mac, but you'd never think to try them because you're used to them not working on L…

Those proxy icons are brilliant. I only discovered them a short while ago but use them all the time now. It’s a shame they are hidden in Big Sur.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#116

I just helped a friend who is a lifetime windows user set up her new MBP M1. I was reminded how un-intuitive things are and how useful UI elements are hidden in the name of "simplicity". A lot of it for her is centered around the finder and accessing files in general. The two biggest issues she had was: 1) finder not easily acting as an image viewer. Eg, she had an SD card from her camera, and wanted to quickly scan…

I switched to Linux a while ago because I was annoyed at Apple for a number of reasons so I'm not exactly an Apple fanboy. However regarding your 1) there is one thing I'm sorely missing and that's QuickLook. No matter what finder view you are in, if you are in a folder with pictures (or even Word documents) you can press the space bar to see an almost full screen preview. Arrows for navigation work as they would if the preview is not open, so if you have ordered by date modified instead of name you will browse the pictures in that order. I have yet to find something in Linux that can do that (even just for pictures).

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, by default Finder seems to hide directory structure from you. This seems to be Apple thinking it'll confuse people if they can see 'up' directories, but I think just as often it confuses people like me who are trying and failing to go up. I use all three major desktop OSes regularly now, and overall Windows just feels like the most user-friendly and straightforward, though of course it too has issues (e.g. vari…

The inability to easily go to $HOME in Finder is of great annoyance to mevwhen combined with app signing. Hashicorp seems to run into this most often - download a new version of Terraform/Packer/whatever, install to ~/.terraform.d/plugins/darwin_amd64, and MacOS sternly tells me I can't run it, with zero instructions on how to proceed. Manually type the path in Finder/Go, Option+Open the binary, then you're good to g…

Are you saying that it's not intuitive for the end user to press Cmd-G, type ~, and then click OK to land in a "home" folder where the majority of the important configuration files are hidden by default?

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#118
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

The worst: pressing Enter to rename a file in finder. Command + Down arrow to open it. WTF!

[deleted]

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#119
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

I think this is a common view held by experienced computer users, because they don't consider which parts of their own usage patterns are a component of their advanced knowledge, and which are inherent to all users. For example: an experienced user is more likely to notice that closing a window in macOS backgrounds the app, and more likely to figure out how to fully exit the app process completely (either via Cmd+Q o…

It is obvious you are used to windows.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#120
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

The worst: pressing Enter to rename a file in finder. Command + Down arrow to open it. WTF!

Macbooks don’t have an Enter key. They have a Return key, which is different: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/47565/return-vs-en...
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