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Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

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Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#741

Post by ric2b »

paulmd wrote: post #602
azinman2 wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except now there isn’t just 1 inspector, but many. And you have to figure out which you trust. Now imagine there’s a very popular restaurant, but it uses an inspector you don’t know if you trust. But you want to eat the food because all your friends are already there… so you’ll go. This is exactly what would happen— various companies once they reach a certain size will just want to have their own store because either…

facebook literally already got their hand slapped for abusing the very limited sideloading mechanisms that Apple already provided. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2019/01/facebook-and-google-... This would generalize that and allow them to sideload for everyone. They straight-up would pull out of the app store, block Safari users from the website, and force everyone to sideload a tracker build on day 1.

> and allow them to sideload for everyone. They straight-up would pull out of the app store, block Safari users from the website, and force everyone to sideload a tracker build on day 1.

I don't understand how people can come up with these crazy hypotheticals when Android has allowed side-loading since forever.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#742

Post by robertlagrant »

pessimizer wrote: post #480
robertlagrant wrote: post #419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also don't curate a language and IDE for you to make your stuff with as well, nor offer logins or ways to find past transactions.

> curate a language and IDE for you to make your stuff with as well That's an odd way to put it. Approximately 0.001% of developers would complain if instead they were allowed to use the language and IDE they prefer.

They can use their IDE, at least. And given every phone platform I know of has restricted language support, I can't imagine it's a simple problem to solve.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#743

Post by calsy »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #561
calsy wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Developers have no leverage because there are no alternatives. What can they do, take their apps and leave the store?

Yes, and if that does not work, then the situation is that not only does each developer need Apple more than Apple needs each developer, but that developers in general need Apple more than Apple needs developers. Which would contradict the claim that developers are having to pay outsize fees compared to their relevance to Apple’s business.

Why are you ignoring the whole purpose of this case? Apple has created an anti-competitive environment that allows them to dictate terms by controlling app distribution on its devices. If there were alternative ways to distribute apps on an iOS device, we wouldn't be having this discussion.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#744

Post by ric2b »

mcphage wrote: post #565
fartcannon wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretending to be ignorant of what is obvious to hold onto your power/money is pretty close to evil. If he believes customers genuinely value his curated app store, let him show us.

> If he believes customers genuinely value his curated app store, let him show us. I think they consider the massive success of the iPhone and App Store proof of that.

I think it's proof that people really like the camera, or the battery life, or the calculator app, or etc.

Without actually asking people, how are sales numbers proof that buyers care a lot about any specific aspect of the product?

And why is everyone forgetting that obviously Apple does ask people and run focus groups, they know very well what their customers are most interested in.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#745

Post by ric2b »

LexGray wrote: post #472
Hamuko wrote: post #2

Tim Cook's line of argument seemed a bit weird to me. On one hand he's saying that he doesn't know if Apple's customers would be able to distinguish between Apple's good and holy curated store and Epic's filthy shitheap of porn and blackjack, but he's also saying that Apple's customers definitely want Apple's App Store as-is. > Lawyer says, “if people really value Apple’s curation and Apple’s App Store, even if there…

A fairly obvious situation where the top google result is “Kid friendly happy fun town App Store” set up by dark web Corp where you can get pre hacked versions of all major commercial apps for free with built in cheats at the cost of porn pop ups and just trust me levels of scamware. Most would go straight to Apple with their issues and how do you fix “I don’t know. My cousin installed it for me”?

So where's the evidence that this is a common issue with Android?

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#746

Post by blacktriangle »

Aeolun wrote: post #599
anonymouse008 wrote: post #591

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone is gawking over the M1 > because your app is using their "IP" in the form of all the libraries and tooling they nigh unto force you to use to build apps that run on their phone; like, to them, UIKit (I presume), Metal (which many people are only using because Apple refused to implement OpenGL or Vulcan), and (this is rich) apparently even Xcode And say what you will about Xcode, but I’m literally building in…

> JetBrains and VSCode are painful to get to function like Xcode Because nobody sane wants them to? Like, to me, I can jump into most any IDE I’ve ever used without too much trouble, but Xcode is impenetrable. It’s like Apple tried to throw up an artificial wall by making all Xcode paradigms different from anything else.

I think that's a bit harsh. I'm quite able to be productive in both JetBrains products and in Xcode. I'd say JetBrains is superior due to the whole Intentions debugging system, but conceptual it is not a quantum leap between the two of them.

Where Xcode falls down is its sheer bugginess.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#747

Post by prepend »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #613

The only aspect of the Apple App Store that strikes me as truly anticompetitive is their prohibition on adjusting prices to include Apple’s fees, or even to tell the user what they are. I can accept that Apple can demand a 30% fee for billing customers on their devices. And I can accept that they would prohibit installation/sales of software any other way. But I should be allowed to mark up the price by 30% and then…

I actually like this as consumers don’t care about price breakdowns. One of the biggest annoyances with consumer prices in the US is the separate price for taxes.

Many countries require net prices advertised and it’s so much simpler, both for ease of mind and for lower prices. Having $10 advertised and then 10% taxes layers on, and convenience fees, and service fees, etc sucks. I’d rather have $12 advertised and not care about all the stuff that goes into it.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#748

Post by Aeolun »

retsibsi wrote: post #668
Aeolun wrote: post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If grandma ignores my advice and installs the unsafe app despite the steadily more large and screaming warnings doesn’t that become individual responsibility at some point?

But what do you want to ensure: that grandma only installs malware on her phone via mistakes she is individually responsible for , or that she doesn't install malware on her phone? Maybe for the abstract 'grandma' you would take the first option. But for someone you personally care about, you're not going to choose the option that predictably ends with her being harmed, even if it will be her own fault when it happen…

You may notice we don’t cover all power outlets because kids (or grandma) may stick their fingers in them either.

I trust them not to do that.

Then again, if iOS has a setting that ‘enables’ the unsafe app store I’m confident grandma won’t reach it since it’s hidden behind the actual passcode, not a fingerprint.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#749

Post by prepend »

sumedh wrote: post #739
cmorgan31 wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So they don’t get to be on iOS. I’d leave ethics and morals out of this convo since neither side has anyone’s interest but their own. Sounds like you already found a solution to this court case - don’t buy Apple if you want to tinker with your hardware. I’m shocked that is news to anyone. I’m shocked so many of us want to dictate what the rest of us have as the status quo because it doesn’t align with your feelings a…

> I’m shocked so many of us want to dictate what the rest of us have as the status quo because it doesn’t align with your feelings and belief system. Would you still support Apple if they said certain race of people cannot use Apple devices. They can always use non Apple devices.

In the US there are protected classes, race being one, that are illegal for discrimination.

Side-loading, right to repair are not similarly protected. Although maybe they will be passed one day.

So if Apple had illegal discriminations, I think that would greatly decrease their support on this issue. Definitely from me.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#750

Post by matz1 »

josephcsible wrote: post #549
tmp231 wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they want? I’m not sure why you think you have a right to dictate private policy on a private platform.

If you buy a Camry and then become an Uber driver, should you have to give Toyota a cut of your earnings?

Depends, If I'm the buyer I don't want it but if I'm Toyota and if I can get a way with it while making more money then its no brainer.
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