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Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

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Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#662
post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We should regulate based on what's best for consumers and the free market. I agree completely, which is why hopefully Apple prevails. Their ecosystem is the best for Apple customers and the free market.

That's a perfectly valid argument IMHO. The argument equating smart phones with consoles however, is downright silly. Can I ask, how does letting me have the option of occasionally purchasing songs, books, movies and character skins direct from vendors hurt your ability to enjoy the benefits of purchasing everything direct from Apple? I just don't understand how that would ruin the system for you . If anything, would…

> The argument equating smart phones with consoles however, is downright silly.

Yea I’m kind of the opposite. I don’t really see the difference. An Xbox has many of the same apps, a web browser, etc.

> I just don't understand how that would ruin the system for you. If anything, wouldn't it force Apple to improve their store in order to be more competitive? Would that not be a benefit to you?

The App Store on iOS and how Apple manages it is effectively a collective bargaining agreement that individual users wouldn’t be all that effective in enforcing. Items like mandating what’s being tracked and how, allowing for anonymous sign-ins, and others are possible because Apple can bargain for users via their control of the App Store.

If you take away the App Store, it’s possible (idk how likely or not though I view it as extremely likely) that Apple I as the user lose that ability to collectively bargain. Companies like Facebook will migrate their apps to third party App Stores where Apple’s beneficial (in my view) rules and terms won’t be enforced. The network effect of apps moving to third party app stores will overwhelm the iOS App Store, and the benefits I enjoy will be largely unenforceable. There won’t be anybody who is even somewhat on my side. There won’t be some sort of competition between a privacy-first Facebook and data harvesting one. So we can’t really tell what users prefer.

Apple also creates a great user experience. One way to pay, a single App Store where everything is, and via their collective bargaining position I can mostly trust that they are trying to enforce rules around privacy, not let junk or scam apps in, etc. I know these rules are not always properly enforced, but they’re there.

So I view third-party app stores as not only not beneficial but hostile to the user experience I enjoy with the iPhone. I’m vehemently against those changes. I’d rather the App Store lose support from major Apps than Apple change how they’re doing things.

And this is kind of how things work on all platforms, stores, etc. There are more strong and loose rules, but I can’t just sell skins on the Epic game store for Fortnite, they don’t allow third-party integrations. I can’t sell apples I grow in my backyard at Wal-Mart either - they have a problem with that. For some reason since Apple makes the best phone and makes the most money people think they should be treated differently, and I don’t.

If users really value these things they’ll buy Android phones or jailbreak iPhones or demand Apple open up things. So far they aren’t. It’s a vocal minority - an absolutely tiny one, and the market seems to pretty clearly say that they prefer things how they are by buying iPhone.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#663
post #620

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And yet it’s apparently insecure for me to buy a Kindle book with the exact same mechanism in the exact same app? Get the fuck out of here. Gonna play the devil's advocate here. If I pay for a physical good, I have an expectation of continued use of that physical good absent of the use the technology medium I used to pay for it. If I buy a physical book and Amazon shut down, I can still read the book. If I pay for…

Why does a book reader app need yearly updates? I bought my ereader years ago still opens epubs fine without updates. If the epub worked when I bought it why does it need to keep updating? Why does an ebook only work on the certified™ app?

1. You picked one example that I explicitly mentioned was an edge case. Thanks.

2. More importantly, if your question is why does ever need updates? Answer: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_entropy

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#664

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're making a usability case between an Apple product, you have to use the comparable Amazon product: Kindle Fire. Amazon's eink readers are a completely different product class than anything from Apple. And on a Kindle fire the experience isn't dramatically different than any other android based system, and the kindle reader apps between Apple and Fires are nearly identical. Comparing an eink interface to iOS i…

How do you account for Amazon's investment in making the Kindle Fire OS updated and valuable? Haven't they paid their own expense to deliver a comparable application? My point on e-ink was to show that Amazon has not invested in the Kindle product line. Kindle readers can't support any modern interaction. And that part of the reason the interface speed is bad is because Amazon has neglected to invest whatsoever in th…

Amazon has produced 11 generations of Fire devices, but they all serve a very specific purpose: a portal to purchasing things from Amazon. That means their innovation has come in the form of having the absolute lowest cost devices for their level of build and hardware quality. They've innovated in that direction, investing quite heavily. You seem to want them to innovate in terms of features: That's fine as an opinion, but that is not the only direction for innovation, and Fires already have the most important feature Amazon wants for consumers: a smooth integration to buying stuff.

Eink readers, as I said, are a completely different product class, not at all comparable to iOS. And if you chart the progress they've made since their original eink devices there have been significant improvements.

The kindle app on Android has a 4.7 star rating. On iOS it's 4.8. A few negative reviews don't mean anything when their ratings are that high. Whatever issues people have, they are outliers.

I'm no Amazon fanboy-- I don't like them very much as a company. But they have absolutely innovated, you just disagree with the directions they have chosen to go with that innovation.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#665

I will not buy any device that does not give me control of the device. If I can't sideload apps, can't install a 3rd party store, do not have the ability to root my own device, I won't buy it. Apple has decided that's not allowed, fine, I won't buy their product. That's between Apple and their customers. But it is certifiably insane that Apple thinks they have the right to dictate to Epic what Epic charges for its ap…

It’s still unclear to me why Apple should have any limits in what rules they set for their store. Don’t publishers have the option to skip Apple’s store and sell in other ones? I mean this isn’t price gouging generators during a winter storm. This is video games and apps. What stops publishers from simply shrugging, walking away, and letting Apple users miss out?

It's still unclear to me why anticompetitive behavior is so hard to understand for people here. Free markets don't exist. Stop pretending they do. Apple has a crazy amount of power over companies selling apps on their platform. Power that would easily be considered a monopoly and anticompetitive if brought to court in, say, Germany. The fact that Apple doesn't own the smartphone market completely is irrelevant. What matters is their potential and real power to unilaterally decide on contract/business matters affecting any number of companies that use their platform.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#666
post #538
post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without Microsoft, the windows eco system wouldnt exist. Should MS get a cut of all windows applications?

If they want? I’m not sure why you think you have a right to dictate private policy on a private platform.

> I’m not sure why you think you have a right to dictate private policy on a private platform.

Well, because it is illegally anti-competitive, and the courts already ruled against microsoft, regarding web browsers.

So thats why. It is because of anti-trust law.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The largest part of app store revenue is games, most games use only a small subset of Apple APIs, and very often only because Apple is not supporting industry standards (like Vulkan or OpenGL)

This is a good argument that it isn't a monopoly.

How is the parent comment at all relevant? Also, and feel free to think this is unrelated, why are so many having such a hard time understanding the basics of anti trust?

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#668
post #610

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually happened more than once. Perhaps the person you were replying to was lying; doesn't make their point valid, because it has actually happened. People can follow the most complicated step by step instructions if they're explained clearly enough, by someone they feel they don't need to trust , and there's an incentive to follow them.

If grandma ignores my advice and installs the unsafe app despite the steadily more large and screaming warnings doesn’t that become individual responsibility at some point?

But what do you want to ensure: that grandma only installs malware on her phone via mistakes she is individually responsible for, or that she doesn't install malware on her phone? Maybe for the abstract 'grandma' you would take the first option. But for someone you personally care about, you're not going to choose the option that predictably ends with her being harmed, even if it will be her own fault when it happens.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#669
post #481
post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you still need to buy a monitor and all peripherals?

I mean you also need to buy a monitor and peripherals for a PC. Since they’re not built in you could find a 1080p monitor on Facebook marketplace locally for almost nothing. If you’re just doing iOS development the Mac mini should be fine.

Doing iOS development includes a whole other bundle of costs associated with it. $1000/yr if you want to even try to sell on the app store?

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#670

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually I definitely do want to A) make it more difficult for spam callers to exist and B) make it more difficult for people to be fooled by them.

The problem with an App Store-like approach to that problem is that Apple would control who could call you and not give you the option to receive calls from someone they don't like. I'm not against security or privacy. My problem is not having a way to bypass the App Store and what they allow (they ban more than just malware) when I want to install something. I use Android for this reason. As soon macOS becomes like…

> My problem is not having a way to bypass the App Store

The ability to bypass the App Store for yourself exists and has for a long time. The process might not be to your liking, but let’s stop pretending that you have no choice if you want to use iOS but not go through the App Store.

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