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Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

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Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#81

Post by notriddle »

celsoazevedo wrote: post #35
exporectomy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes less freedom is a good thing. It frees the customer's mind to let an organization they trust make the tedious product evaluations for you. We do it all the time with retail shopping where we enjoy the curated decisions of the shop's owner instead of a giant bazaar.

On the other hand, when Apple decides to block some app (eg: certain VPN apps in China) for reasons that aren't in your interest, you're screwed. Being able to use a different app store (which may or may not be as "curated" as Apple's own store) or to simply download the app from the devs website and install it doesn't seem to be a problem for Android users. Or for Windows, Linux and even macOS (eg: is it that bad be…

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27221083

Apparently, yes, it is a problem.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#82

Post by maccard »

hpaavola wrote: post #71
maccard wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the existence of the epic store on wjncows has had an effect on the content of steam? A really good example right now is riot. They distribute through their own launcher on PC rather than on steam. They have two sizeable games on mobile right now (wild rift and TFT). In a world where these are downloadable from the riot launcher on iOS rather than the app store, it seems likely riot (and other major publ…

Instead of trying to compare to other totally different products, do the comparison to Android. Has any 3rd party appstore affected play store in any way? No. Start your argument from that fact.

Yes. Fortnite isn't on the play store.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#83

Post by slver »

wccrawford wrote: post #4

Other news on this has quotes from Tim Cook saying that they'd have to find a way to track purchases on IOS and bill developers so that Apple still gets their cut when using other payment processors. For me, this is way over the line. If they want to charge developers to be on their store, fine. I don't have a problem with that. And charging for using them as a payment processor makes sense. Charging for using Apple…

What you're saying is that you're OK with basically every single developer declaring their app as free, and then asking for your credit card, which will be processed in god knows what ways with most of them.

So developers get in the shortterm to avoid the 30% cut. But what happens next?

The payment process becomes much more cumbersome and much less safe for users. So they start avoiding any payments on iPhone.

Apple loses basically all funding to maintain and curate the store.

And in the long-term developers lose the entire platform, because it's based on the goodwill of the users.

Who wins?

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#84

Post by cat199 »

belltaco wrote: post #66
adflux wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Charging people to make use of their IP is fair IMO. Its similar to paying taxes, even if you don't use the services the taxes are for. The user benefits from Apple maintaining their OS, so has to pay. A citizen paying taxes benefits from all the services the country offers, so he pays taxes.

Imagine Microsoft doing this on Windows.

or any web browser doing this for e-commerce..

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#85

Post by toss1 »

calsy wrote: post #73
lotsofpulp wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each developer needs apple more than Apple needs each developer. Developers need to ally with each other, then they can force Apple’s hands. What’s funny is that developers are practically in the best job to do that. Their jobs allow them tons of time to communicate with each other, they’re highly educated and able to communicate, and they have the know how to operate the mechanisms allowing them to communicate (foru…

Developers have no leverage because there are no alternatives. What can they do, take their apps and leave the store?

Yes, exactly that - go on strike.

And the position is just like employees - one leaves, and mgt says "so what"? Many leave and mgt is screwed.

Maybe developers could even create a fund to help themselves survive a 'strike', and/or to help fund alternatives such as versions on Android.

Enough leave en masse, and Apple will have no choice but to listen.

Until then, Apple divides & conquers.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#86

Post by slver »

doikor wrote: post #78
newsclues wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple doesn’t take a cut of transactions I make in my iPhones browser.

And for how long would Safari on iOS keep up with new features or not get its performance nuked if for example games started to move into browser apps in major numbers on iOS. Apple itself said in the trial that games pretty much subsidize all other apps in terms of the money Apple makes out of the App Store. iOS Safari already lags behind in features. Apple would just make it even worse if it started to cost them si…

Apple lags behind Chrome in some features which curiously directly benefit Google.

It's not slow, it's not broken. It's a great mobile browser. So stick to reality and not bunch of made up "what ifs".

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#87

Post by codyb »

emsy wrote: post #26
akg_67 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that it disproportionately benefits Apple but alternative is free for all like Android and all responsibilities fall on end user (not possible when you have from very young users to very old users, both unsophisticated and sophisticated users).

I just don’t buy the argument that end customers will lose out. The Apple AppStore will still be the default and available. People that want alternatives can get them at their own peril (like responsible adults, can you imagine?). And what percentage of people actually use alt app stores on Android?

I’m surprised fragmentation isn’t mentioned.

With multiple app stores, developers may not release to the Apple app store any more. Causing users to either use other app stores or miss out on apps that would previously been in the Apple store.

Causing them to be forced to evaluate the trustworthiness of each new app store they have to use.

Which will inevitably lead to some less tech savvy users having their information phished out from their phones.

Personally, it sounds like a hassle to me. I’m a big fan of the walled garden approach because I have zero desire to evaluate app store’s credibility and don’t feel I’m missing out on anything that could be side loaded, but then again, I only use my phone for communication, dating, photos, craigslist, and hackernews lately.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#88

Post by ohgodplsno »

tomp wrote: post #40
Hamuko wrote: post #2

Tim Cook's line of argument seemed a bit weird to me. On one hand he's saying that he doesn't know if Apple's customers would be able to distinguish between Apple's good and holy curated store and Epic's filthy shitheap of porn and blackjack, but he's also saying that Apple's customers definitely want Apple's App Store as-is. > Lawyer says, “if people really value Apple’s curation and Apple’s App Store, even if there…

You're making Tim Cook sound stupid and/or evil, but he does have a point. > If customers really value real, safe drugs, even if there's multiple drug suppliers (some offering fake, unsafe drugs), people should still go to a pharmacy? > It seems like a decision that they shouldn't have to make. > Will people not be able to distinguish between safe drugs and fake unsafe drugs? > They've never had to do it before.

Equating alternative app stores to literal drug dealers.

I don't think I even need to say anything to point out how bad of an argument it is.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#89

Post by pseingatl »

Apple's lawyers screwed up, big time. It is unimaginable that a party to a lawsuit would tell the judge, "You and I have a different view." OMG. Better go in the hall right there and then, Timmy, because the person holding the "different view" is deciding your case. There are dozens of other ways to get your point across without openly disagreeing with the judge. Apple is toast.

Re: Tim Cook’s Fortnite trial testimony was unexpectedly revealing

#90

Post by ben_w »

dannyw wrote: post #79
duped wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they believe that so much they believe they can skim off the top of certain areas of commerce on iOS. If they did it with bank transactions, Apple Pay, Venmo, Robinhood, etc then people would be up in arms.

Divide and conquer. It's gaming and software apps now. It'll be bank transactions and commerce later on. A 1% "Apple Platform Safety Fee" on Robinhood wouldn't surprise me....

Sounds like you’re complaining about a hypothetical future where they charge less than Visa and MasterCard?

https://www.fool.com/the-ascent/research/average-credit-card...

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