Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams • Hacker News Board

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#201

Post by throway98752343 » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:06 AM UTC

jasonwatkinspdx wrote: post #199

The next looming issue for Twitch is the Slots/Video Poker streamers. Similar to swim suits, I don't think gambling as a whole should be totally against ToS. There are some great poker streamers, and there've been some quite successful charity drives around casino games. But there's also one big streamer, famous with the CoD audience, that lately has been playing video poker on one of those bitcoin casino sites. He h…

A test I like to use to isolate my concerns is replacement.

Replace "actual money" with "fake money" in this casino example. Is the streamer playing poker entertaining, or are people watching because of the high-stakes gambling?

Replace "woman" for "man" in these tub streams. Are people watching for the games or the streamer's personality, or for their body?

I'd go so far as to say you should be able to replace within any protected class with minimal effect on viewership. If that's not true, there's some bias being expressed.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#202

Post by 0xy » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:16 AM UTC

jasonwatkinspdx wrote: post #199

The next looming issue for Twitch is the Slots/Video Poker streamers. Similar to swim suits, I don't think gambling as a whole should be totally against ToS. There are some great poker streamers, and there've been some quite successful charity drives around casino games. But there's also one big streamer, famous with the CoD audience, that lately has been playing video poker on one of those bitcoin casino sites. He h…

The ship has sailed on that, given EA and Activision have already pioneered slot machines for kids known as loot boxes.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#203

Post by rgoulter » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:18 AM UTC

gary_0 wrote: post #40

Aside from the "I know it when I see it"[0] angle, here are my thoughts. Long, long ago, I dabbled in content hosting, and still sometimes daydream about doing business along those lines. When it comes to the thought of my hypothetical service hosting purely sexual content it's not due to any puritanism that I'd prefer that my platform have rules against it. Sexual content (ie. porn) brings with it regulatory burdens…

Yeah. The post makes much more sense to me in terms of arguing that it doesn't go against regulations / rules of their payment processors, etc.

It seems they've had trouble in the past trying to draw lines around sexual activity. It's a safe bet that if hot tub streams got banned, all the involved streamers would still keep toeing the line as far as they can. Drawing a broad line & cordoning it off seems reasonable.

Though I wonder if there remains an incentive for pushing boundaries in 'just chatting'.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#204

Post by belltaco » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:18 AM UTC

twobitshifter wrote: post #178

belltaco wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're missing the point of Twitch and also its culture. Twitch is closer to cable TV than anything else, even the terminology is the same, with 'channels'. Except that anyone can create a channel and stream it within the rules. The fact that there's some content you don't like on other channels being does not mean you shouldn't watch the streamers that you like. Just like there's a wide variety in content thats broa…

Clicked on wolframs channel, on the left side bar of recommended channels is a live indicator for someone named "Amouranth" streaming pools, hottubs, and beaches with 14.9k viewers.

YouTube recommendations have been historically way worse with not much push back. Not to mention way more sexually explicit content on YouTube.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#205

Post by belltaco » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:21 AM UTC

idiotsecant wrote: post #186

Siira wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has there been any good meta analyses on the effects of suggestive content on children? My prior is that seeing sex was common enough in the ancestral environment, both human and animal sex, and children won’t be much effected from this content floating around.

The difference is that hot tub twitch isn't an actual interaction between two people, its a dopamine feedback loop that warps an un-jaded mind into thinking it's reality.

Is that also true of VR games, games in general, multiplayer games, concerts,TV, videos, watching a streamer play games, movies, social media etc. etc.?

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#206

Post by viraptor » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:27 AM UTC

throway98752343 wrote: post #164

viraptor wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also any policy like that would hit women who are into positive body expression, without trying to use it as a popularity tool. I.e. they'd have to figure out how to tell apart those who work on being suggestive for money and that who just enjoy being suggestive in life. Kind of like the repeating issue for https://mobile.twitter.com/RealSexyCyborg who as far as I can tell is strongly in the second category. But that…

Isn't body positivity supposed to be celebrating bodies that aren't traditionally attractive?

It's more generic - basically it's about not judging people's worth or intentions by their bodies. Whether they're unusually obese, unusually sexually attractive, unusually something else...

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#207

Post by t-writescode » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:31 AM UTC

bombcar wrote: post #35

autocorr wrote: post #10

> Community and advertiser feedback made clear that we need to offer more ways to control the content that’s recommended as well as where ads appear. So, we’re introducing a new category: Pools, Hot Tubs, and Beaches. If you have chosen swimwear that is allowed under the “Swim and Beaches” contextual exception to our standard Nudity and Attire policy, you should stream into the Pools, Hot Tubs and Beaches category. P…

Isn't it obvious? The advertisers don't want to advertise on a camsite, those are available elsewhere. Trying to document and define "I'll know it when I see it" is an NP-complete problem, and this won't be the end of it.

Automating “I’ll know it when I see it” is closer to the halting problem. It might even be definable in those terms.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#208

Post by viraptor » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:44 AM UTC

bluefirebrand wrote: post #124

viraptor wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also any policy like that would hit women who are into positive body expression, without trying to use it as a popularity tool. I.e. they'd have to figure out how to tell apart those who work on being suggestive for money and that who just enjoy being suggestive in life. Kind of like the repeating issue for https://mobile.twitter.com/RealSexyCyborg who as far as I can tell is strongly in the second category. But that…

> they'd have to figure out how to tell apart those who work on being suggestive for money and that who just enjoy being suggestive in life I don't think they'd bother trying to tell them apart. The issue Twitch wants to police here isn't the willingness or coercion, it's the suggestiveness behaviour entirely.

If they actually attempted that, it would blow up in their face, because there's no clear line. There will always be very attractive women who will not want to cover themselves up just to satisfy some policy. They will get flagged in that situation as suggestive either maliciously or in genuine false positives. (This already happens in other places, which is why I'm so certain)

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#209

Post by swagasaurus-rex » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:49 AM UTC

didibus wrote: post #11

> Sexually suggestive content–and where to draw the line–is an area that is particularly complex to assess, as sexual suggestiveness is a spectrum that involves some degree of personal interpretation of where the line falls This is just in general why I have an issue with prudeness in our society. I have no idea where prudeness comes from, is it innate to some people? Is it a taught trait? But it seems to cause so mu…

It's the reaction itself that's discordant.

People put on a show. Others are drawn to watch. It's such a reliable mechanism that it can be monetized.

Re: Let’s Talk About Hot Tub Streams

#210

Post by LegitShady » Sat, May 22, 2021, 3:49 AM UTC

jtolmar wrote: post #172

LegitShady wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>existing lewd stuff out onto a new platform, not starting a PornHub alternative These are the same things.

They're suggesting a platform for sexually suggestive content, as opposed to one for sexually explicit content. Which might actually be a viable niche. There are a lot more explicit websites out there than softcore ones.

I understand the distinction, but ultimately the reputation issue for twitch would be identical.

"They're opening a porn site?"

"No no, its a separate site for softcore...err sexually suggestive material"

It isn't a win either way, and they'd be entering established markets that already have entrenched businesses and wouldn't have the 'walk through' traffic the video games sections of twitch provide.