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Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

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Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#181

Post by akersten »

_vertigo wrote: post #145
wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

It's honestly pretty surprising to me to see how many people on here are supporting this move. That's not what I would expect, I would expect people on HN to object to this move on principle. Maybe my prediction in where most HN commenters stand in principle on this issue is wrong, or just maybe, this is a rare example of a time when the principle (hardware should be free to run at their max capability, not deliberat…

It's been a shift I've noticed over the last ~15(?) years of browsing these and similar forums - as they become more well-known and frequented by the general public, the opinions start to lose nuance and aren't as tightly coupled to the principles from which the forum was borne.

Similar example - government regulation of tech: if, 15 years ago, you were to tell a community of Hackers that the EU was planning a massive law to regulate the way you can process data that internet browsers voluntarily send to your server, there would be principled outrage. But, speak ill of GDPR on today's HN, and you'll quickly find yourself inundated with anti-tech talking points.

The filter bubble doesn't last forever :)

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#182

Post by _vertigo »

thereare5lights wrote: post #160
_vertigo wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's honestly pretty surprising to me to see how many people on here are supporting this move. That's not what I would expect, I would expect people on HN to object to this move on principle. Maybe my prediction in where most HN commenters stand in principle on this issue is wrong, or just maybe, this is a rare example of a time when the principle (hardware should be free to run at their max capability, not deliberat…

> I would expect people on HN to object to this move on principle. I cannot think of any principle that would cause me to object to this. Blind fealty to general purpose computing here conflicts with the very real world impact on non-crypto consumers. If we're being utilitarian, it seems to me that it would be obvious that this is a good move.

I mean, why are non-crypto consumers better than crypto ones from a utilitarian POV? (I play video games and dislike crypto - I'm just asking). I suppose that people do things other than gaming with 3080s, because I would be hard pressed to make a convincing argument that gaming is somehow so much more valuable of a hobby than mining crypto that it's worth the hit to general purpose computing to specifically ban crypto

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#183

Post by amelius »

FinanceAnon wrote: post #178
nyjah wrote: post #125

I have a dumb theoretical question, but I genuinely don't understand the answer. Why wouldn't nvidia and amd or any other card maker just keep the cards and mine all the cryptocurrency for themselves?

"In a gold rush - sell shovels."

Yeah, but don't sell crippled shovels.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#184

Post by mrgordon »

ahD5zae7 wrote: post #172

Actually, is there a need to block anything? They're coming up with a mining-focused product line now. Just make them slightly cheaper per hash and voila - all miners will be buying the mining-focused products. They lack the video outputs so it makes sense, you can skip some of the BOM on the card, save a few bucks. As it has already been mentioned in the thread miners are super sensitive to squeezing every cent out…

The issue is the resale value for actual working GPUs is higher so the miners will often buy the normal cards anyway

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#185

Post by gruez »

slver wrote: post #149
nyjah wrote: post #125

I have a dumb theoretical question, but I genuinely don't understand the answer. Why wouldn't nvidia and amd or any other card maker just keep the cards and mine all the cryptocurrency for themselves?

> Why wouldn't nvidia and amd or any other card maker just keep the cards and mine all the cryptocurrency for themselves? Bitcoin costs more to mine than the power bill you'll receive. This is why increasingly most malware happens by stealing power one way or another. And I don't think NVidia and AMD are in the stealing power business.

>Bitcoin costs more to mine than the power bill you'll receive

he's talking about cryptocurrencies in general, not bitcoin specifically. Mining ETH with recent-ish is currently profitable unless your electricity is very expensive (50+ cents). Besides, bitcoin mining is dominated by ASICs and there really isn't really any point in using hacked computers to mine it because there are more profitable coins (ones using ASIC resistant algorithms).

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#186

Post by Ericson2314 »

disgruntledphd2 wrote: post #171
988747 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one mines BTC on GPU, and Etherum is up 100% from two weeks ago. Ok, I understand that NVidia does not want to mine themselves, but why on Earth won't they just raise the prices to the level miners are willing to pay? "We want to sell to gamers, not miners" is the stupidest excuse ever. Isn't capitalism all about selling to the highest bidder? Why do they even care about who buys their product? EDIT: Also, think a…

Gamers are the reason why Nvidia exists, it's a hard thing to let go of. It would be like FB shutting down the blue app and pivoting to Tinder.

Hah, this comparison very much feels right.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#187

Post by exmicrosoldier »

neither_color wrote: post #77
wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

While I wholeheartedly agree that nvidia should do this, what bothers me is that they take functionality away without adding anything in or lowering the price. They are selling a "technically" inferior SKU for the same price.

I work in SaaS. Availability is a key feature.

A service with more features that I can't use is less valuable than one with less features that I can use whenever I want.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#188

Post by superbaconman »

I'm on the fence about switching from console to pc, but I've still been trying to get a 3000 series card anyway. The ability to use the cards for ml and crypo in addition to gaming is appealing, but moves like this just make me think sticking to xbox and my gtx560 is best.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#189

Post by joe_the_user »

akersten wrote: post #123
slownews45 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm thrilled by this. This has been a common approach in I think almost every industry. What nvidia is doing is recognizing that the needs of existing long time consumers / clients / partners are not being met by the current situation. Yes, it inflates short term profits and increases their pricing power, but long run if you can't buy nvidia for your dev box, your game box etc, this reduces the long run nvidia ecosys…

If this works (spoiler: it won't, it will be cracked within a month), it will create more e-Waste as miners will toss their no-video-output-mining-only cards after they're no longer the latest tech, instead of being able to resell them to gamers, thinning the used graphics card market, forcing more gamers to buy new from nVidia instead of rebuying old cards online. That makes me angry, it should make you angry too.

I don't like Nvidia's approach for other reasons (mostly 'cause market segmentation raises prices in the end imo). But I'm pretty sure miners very price oriented. They'd sell rather than trash whatever cards they have. And it seems unlikely they'd be using any unsellable cards since those are energy inefficient.

There's a shortage of Nvidia card/chips after all.

Edit: Now I read the article, this is literally only being added to new cards and with a warning.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#190

Post by edave64 »

slver wrote: post #149
nyjah wrote: post #125

I have a dumb theoretical question, but I genuinely don't understand the answer. Why wouldn't nvidia and amd or any other card maker just keep the cards and mine all the cryptocurrency for themselves?

> Why wouldn't nvidia and amd or any other card maker just keep the cards and mine all the cryptocurrency for themselves? Bitcoin costs more to mine than the power bill you'll receive. This is why increasingly most malware happens by stealing power one way or another. And I don't think NVidia and AMD are in the stealing power business.

People are buying these cards for other coins that are still profitable to mine on the GPU.
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