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Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

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Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#101

Post by lacker »

neither_color wrote: post #77
wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

While I wholeheartedly agree that nvidia should do this, what bothers me is that they take functionality away without adding anything in or lowering the price. They are selling a "technically" inferior SKU for the same price.

They aren't really "selling" the unlocked RTX 3080, though. They go for $2500 on ebay, and you're essentially winning a lottery if you manage to get one at the advertised $800 price. In practice acquiring a restricted RTX 3080 is going to be a lot cheaper than acquiring an unrestricted one.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#102

Post by outworlder »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

> I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to be AMD due to this behavior by Nvidia.

I was thinking about buying NVIDIA for the next GPU based on performance numbers alone.

However, against it there's:

1) Terrible Linux support(and history). This is specially important now that most of Steam's library runs on Linux without issues. It was eye-opening to see Cyberpunk running almost perfectly on DAY ONE with the same performance as Windows. In the case of AMD, with open source drivers.

2)Control freak shenanigans (see also: this thread). This is doing nothing to address the GPU shortage. It's just dishonest market segmentation.

3)Their completely unacceptable behavior regarding reviews. They were punishing reviewers that didn't place enough emphasis in ray tracing. They would be blacklisted just by saying it's not important (which I happen to agree with). They handled the situation horribly.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#103

Post by slownews45 »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

I'm thrilled by this. This has been a common approach in I think almost every industry.

What nvidia is doing is recognizing that the needs of existing long time consumers / clients / partners are not being met by the current situation. Yes, it inflates short term profits and increases their pricing power, but long run if you can't buy nvidia for your dev box, your game box etc, this reduces the long run nvidia ecosystem.

Crypto folks come and go. Serve them on a short term basis with something at a higher price point or make them lock in long term orders

Almost every business works this way. Long time regular customer - you get pricing option A. Rando runs in with lots of cash? You don't let them destroy your long term customer relationships, but sell them some extra / high margin stuff if they are willing to pay enough.

Intel just went through this ecosystem pain with ARM. They said no to doing iphone chip. Now an ecosystem has built up around ARM with far more investment than would have been there without apple leading the way.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#104

Post by cma »

void_mint wrote: post #61
wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

At some point, someone has to take action against harmful behavior, right? In the last few years, we've seen tons extremely problematic behavior arise out of well-principled technology (all of social media, cryptocurrency, etc). Groups of people say "When will we do something?!?!?!", and then, when something is done, other people say "But the principle of ___!". Sometime, someone has to do something about problematic…

Do you really believe Nvidia is being an enforcer here to "take action against harmful behavior"? It's just price discrimination. They saw they were leaving money on the table. Unless they thought it a huge PR win to do it, it's probably not much different in motivation than the previous thing with them segmenting out datacenter use.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#105

Post by burnethtards »

You can customize mining algorithms to work on any hardware....

Either way gpu mining was always a terrible idea since they have resale value and thus cost of attack was small vs ASICs that are rendered worthless when they attack their own chain effectively unable to break even on sunk costs.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#106

Post by mdoms »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #78
varispeed wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the business case for prioritising casual non-tech customer over bulk order specialist customer?

The casual customer will still be buying GPUs 10 years from now. The bulk order GPU miners will stop ordering GPUs the minute mining becomes unprofitable. With proof-of-stake and ASICs on the horizon, this could happen rather abruptly. When miners are done with GPUs, they're going to unload them on the secondary market. The used GPU market is going to be flooded with GPUs that have been overclocked and run with the d…

They're also instantly selling every single GPU they can produce either way, so there's no downside.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#107

Post by behringer »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

Good luck getting a next gen AMD GPU for any reasonable price if NVidia successfully segments away the miners and AMD doesn't.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#108

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #78
varispeed wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the business case for prioritising casual non-tech customer over bulk order specialist customer?

The casual customer will still be buying GPUs 10 years from now. The bulk order GPU miners will stop ordering GPUs the minute mining becomes unprofitable. With proof-of-stake and ASICs on the horizon, this could happen rather abruptly. When miners are done with GPUs, they're going to unload them on the secondary market. The used GPU market is going to be flooded with GPUs that have been overclocked and run with the d…

This - plus if all the new GPUs are going into ETH miners rather than gaming rigs, what incentive will game developers have to target new features or optimize for them?

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#109

Post by bee_rider »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #78
varispeed wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is the business case for prioritising casual non-tech customer over bulk order specialist customer?

The casual customer will still be buying GPUs 10 years from now. The bulk order GPU miners will stop ordering GPUs the minute mining becomes unprofitable. With proof-of-stake and ASICs on the horizon, this could happen rather abruptly. When miners are done with GPUs, they're going to unload them on the secondary market. The used GPU market is going to be flooded with GPUs that have been overclocked and run with the d…

And it is a pretty common complaint that companies sacrifice long-term interest for short term concerns. It is interesting to see a company apparently intentionally make the opposite decision (and have people still complain).

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#110

Post by Siira »

seneca wrote: post #16
creato wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is unfortunate, but it is less unfortunate than the behavior of crypto miners. Freedom is great when people aren't using their freedom to infringe on other people's freedom.

> Freedom is great when people aren't using their freedom to infringe on other people's freedom. Other people driving up the price on something you want is not "[infringing] on other people's freedom". It's an inconvenience, but you're still completely free to buy at the inflated price.

People hate competition. It’s not like the big tech is made out of bricks. The small timer says competing users of GPUs are evil, the Apple lawyer bullshits on how they can’t even allow mentions of alternative payment gateways less the security gods become angry.
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