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Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

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Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#211

Post by SigmundA »

xiphias2 wrote: post #209
SigmundA wrote: post #117

This is at 66.9 km/h (40 mph) in order to greatly increase its range due to lower drag compared to normal highway speeds. As a comparison a Tesla Model 3 got 975km (606 miles) at 40 km/h (25 mph) [1]. I can't seem to find any range tests at a similar speed as the Nexo. I found an EPA dyno test for the Model 3 at 77 km/h (48mph) for 708 km (440 miles). The Nexo and Model 3 have similar dimension and weight and price,…

Hydrogen makes much more sense for container ships, where electric batteries can't be made practical, but hydrogen storage can be scaled easily.

I agree also perhaps for grid scale storage

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#213

Post by MayeulC »

baybal2 wrote: post #192
goodpoint wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than a gasoline bomb, hopefully. Gasoline is more dangerous.

Few kg of hydrogen are surely more dangerous than 50 kg of gasoline.

120 MJ/kg for H2 vs 46 MJ/kg for gasoline.

Both are explosive, so I think (I'm no authority on this) we can compare those values directly, without taking into account the storage pressure.

Source: https://hypertextbook.com/facts/2005/MichelleFung.shtml https://hypertextbook.com/facts/2003/ArthurGolnik.shtml

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#214

Post by HPsquared »

asciimov wrote: post #198

I've always hoped hydrogen would have taken off. Since you can convert gas engines to run off of hydrogen it would be easier to move the market to hydrogen than electric. Allowing us to build out the infrastructure first, then transition vehicles over to fuel cell.

Burning hydrogen in an ICE is a very expensive and inefficient process. It's a bit like electric heating, you need to first make the hydrogen which is itself a lossy process. In both cases, the "high-quality" energy source that is produced, can be efficiently used by a specific process (fuel cells for hydrogen, heat pumps for electricity) or squandered in an inefficient conversion process (internal combustion engine for hydrogen, resistive heating for electricity).

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#215

Post by jbarberu »

marvin wrote: post #76
yonaguska wrote: post #63

> “I was constantly checking the Nexo’s efficiency readout to maximise the distance I was getting per kilogram of hydrogen. I found that by using techniques from rally driving, such as looking as far down the road as possible, as well as tips I have learned from my dad for driving a truck efficiently over long distances, it’s actually possible to go way beyond Nexo’s official range.” Anyone have some insights on this…

It generally breaks down to don’t brake unless you have to, and know & use the performance characteristics of whatever you’re driving. This might mean slowing down while anticipating stoplight changes, curves or congestion behavior so you can just keep rolling, not accelerating over the top of a hill or entering a decline with excess speed, leaving a good distance to the car in front and so on. Also knowing the effic…

When you go in neutral downhill your engine idles, vs if you leave it in gear the ECU cuts fuel supply completely. It's generally better to stay in gear except when you're at a standstill. (This assumes a modern vehicle with fuel-injectors)

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#216

Post by Keyframe »

mda wrote: post #23
Keyframe wrote: post #15

Isn't driving on a tank full of hydrogen like super dangerous?

Driving a car tank full of gasoline or thousands of lithium batteries is also dangerous, there are ways to reduce risk.

There's dangerous and then there's super dangerous!

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#217

Post by darksaints »

bdamm wrote: post #92
sandworm101 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is, but it doesn't have to be. It is possible to make H2 from H20 and sunlight. At the moment there is little market for such "green" hydrogen but the hope is that hydrogen-based transportation will create that market. Imho I cannot afford to be a market leaders in this field. Until H2 is available everywhere, including at remote locations during Canadian winters, I'll have to stick to gas stations. (I have yet to…

While technically true, the conversion is inefficient. It takes a lot of power to extract H2 from H2O. You could just use that power directly. The problem with electrics in -50 is keeping them plugged in when not in use. -50 is very extreme though, you’re talking far north or Edmonton.

The conversion using current SOEC technology isn't particularly inefficient. 88% efficient when using LHV values, 105% efficient when using HHV.

http://www.helmeth.eu/index.php/technologies/high-temperatur...

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#218

Post by JPKab »

danogentili wrote: post #188
JPKab wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The key to a hydrogen economy will rely on creation of hydrogen in locations with extremely abundant electricity like Iceland. The next step is shipping it like it's LNG. Not a small order.

> The key to a hydrogen economy will rely on wasting energy on creation of hydrogen in locations with extremely abundant electricity. Honestly, this sounds just as bad as setting up bitcoin mines in places with high rates of renewables, to avoid directly throwing tons of CO2 in the atmosphere. Even if you have loads of clean energy, that's no reason to waste it when there are more efficient ways of using it (lithium…

I don't think there's a scarcity issue with electricity in places like Iceland where volcanic activity provides massive areas of land where electricity can be freely and easily generated. The issue is the ability to transport said electricity without massive losses.

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#219

Post by [deleted] »

SigmundA wrote: post #117

This is at 66.9 km/h (40 mph) in order to greatly increase its range due to lower drag compared to normal highway speeds. As a comparison a Tesla Model 3 got 975km (606 miles) at 40 km/h (25 mph) [1]. I can't seem to find any range tests at a similar speed as the Nexo. I found an EPA dyno test for the Model 3 at 77 km/h (48mph) for 708 km (440 miles). The Nexo and Model 3 have similar dimension and weight and price,…

[deleted]

Re: Hyundai Nexo sets new world record 887.5 km travelled on single tank of hydrogen

#220

Post by jdblair »

Robotbeat wrote: post #107
jdblair wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on how you define convenient. Hydrogen can be refilled quickly, in minutes, like a conventional liquid fueled car. If there were a network of hydrogen filling stations then driving, especially long distances, would be similar to driving a liquid fueled car.

Right. Similar to a liquid fueled car, but worse than an electric car in most circumstances. But the problem is there will never be an equivalent hydrogen network as there is gasoline network because hydrogen fueling stations are far more expensive to install and maintain. Either the station overhead ends up much higher than gasoline or hydrogen is used much more rarely. Electric car distance records as of 2018 are 1…

Just for the record, I agree H2 fueled cars make terrible sense. On top of the points you make, hydrogen is simply too hard to store.
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